peoplespeace
Professional
Which female players have atp forehand? I referring to the late supination and relaxed snapping wrist. Ie more like Fogning and Dimitrov (and Federer!) than eg Chardy.
WTA players with ATP forehand.
- Thread starter peoplespeace
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SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Justine Henin
Daria Kasatkina
Amanda Anisimova?
Christina McHale
Jennifer Brady
Sam Stossur
Iga Swiatek
Jo Konta?
A few of these might be hybrid styles
Daria Kasatkina
Amanda Anisimova?
Christina McHale
Jennifer Brady
Sam Stossur
Iga Swiatek
Jo Konta?
A few of these might be hybrid styles
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
ATP/WTA hybrid?
Emma Raducanu
Lleylah Fernandez
Emma Raducanu
Lleylah Fernandez
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Curious
G.O.A.T.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
@Curious
I posed the question above because the AA Fh displays elements of both styles. A compact WTA? Or a pseudo-ATP or modern Fh?
I've often referred to it as a hybrid implementation. But I believe the Fh strokes of Garbine M. and Amanda A. are actually closer to a compact, modern Fh rather than a classic WTA Fh. More compact, more "modern" than Serena or Simona.
I posed the question above because the AA Fh displays elements of both styles. A compact WTA? Or a pseudo-ATP or modern Fh?
Maybe I need to recalibrate because that looks like a WTA FH to me.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Compare it to Serena, Simona, Dayana Y or others with Fh stokes that are more of a classic WTA style. AA is significantly more compact than Sloane.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
I'd say AA is more compact and closer to modern or ATP Fh than thisWhat would you call this?
Curious
G.O.A.T.
To me it’s the same as Halep’s except the size.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
To be clear, when I speak of "compact", I'm not referring to the size of the loop. It's much more about whether or not the racket is pulled behind the body -- behind the coronal plan.
Look at the (extreme) direction of Simona's racket on her take back. Not as extreme as Sloane but quite a bit more than Amanda.
Simona pulls her whole racket and her hand behind her body (coronal plane). But Amanda does not. At most, only the tip of her racket breaks that plane. Huge diff.
(Of course there are also some other elements that might distinguish a classic WTA Fh from a prototypical ATP Fh)
Curious
G.O.A.T.
IMO the simple defining element is the position of forearm on take back.
Pronated ATP
Supinated WTA
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Defining element? Not sure I agree.
Pronated or supinated at what part of the takeback? (I believe that my own ATP implementation is neutral)
As I indicated, there are several elements that might characterize each Fh style. AA checks boxes for both WTA and ATP styles but I see her modern Fh implementation closer to the ATP. Her takeback is considerably more compact than SH. For me that's a significant criteria.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Supination is the main factor that takes the racket behind coronal plane.
Ok, neutral is also acceptable. Supinated at the highest part of the take back makes WTA what it is.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
I'm thinking that it's also possible to achieve that with little or no supination. That takeback could conceivably be realized, primarily, with horizontal shoulder abduction and an active wrist extension. Not uncommon to see an active flip (extension) of the wrist on the takeback for some WTA implementations. I cringe when I see that active extension.
Different ways to get the racket way back there. Somewhat dependent on the Fh grip employed
Curious
G.O.A.T.
peoplespeace
Professional
Are there female players who have a straight arm at contact?
peoplespeace
Professional
The highest part or rather the "deepest" part, ie just before the forward swing?
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Leyla Fernandez
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Something like that. ATP forward swing forces the forearm to supinate. WTA doesn’t as it is already supinated. That’s also why they don’t get any flip of racket backwards.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
I had indicated that Lleylah might have a hybrid Fh style. The straight arm technique she employs is rather interesting. I had forgotten that she did that.
Her take back is not as large as a typical WTA. Her racket head breaks the plane a bit but it is still pretty compact. I see some forearm supination on her racket drop but do not notice any earlier, for her take back.
Appears to be a modern / ATP variation. not WTA (but perhaps hybrid).
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
I had also indicated that Emma R might also utilize a hybrid Fh technique. Looking at this video, it appears to be more ATP than WTA. In his video, Ryan indicates that she does not employ as much leg as Roger does but in other respects it is a modern (ATP) Fh
peoplespeace
Professional
However, she contacts with a bent arm which is quintessntially WTA although many ATP players also do this, most notably Djokovic.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Only one Fh in this vid. Amanda's Fh has likely changed over time. It could also be situational. In this clip, her Fh looks different from her shadow swings and her Fh strokes hitting against Nick K earlier in this thread.
She prepares quite a higher in this video than the others. But still her takeback is on the compact side. She doesn't take it back a far as a typical WTA Fh
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SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
The straight arm Fh is only one variation of the ATP Fh. While there are more players in the past few years hitting straight arm than there once was, a vast majority of the ATP forehands were bent arm like Djoko & Murray when the concept was first presented.
The straight-arm Fh of Fed, Nadal & a few others were the exception, not the rule, for ATP Fh when Christophe D introduced the concept 8+ years ago. Part of the following video includes a repost of the original Christophe video
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Didn't expect this from Nik. I can't go to the club with a WTA FH or the BROs will laugh at me.What would you call this?
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
WTA Fh good enuff for Del Potro, Chardy and other ATP players
Rec tennis is a demanding game, aesthetics being a fundamental aspect of it.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Aesthetics may be fundamental yet I've seen plenty with gr8 looking ground strokes but goofy looking serve motions
That is something unforgivable, unfortunately it is pretty common, there must be at least some balance.
Dragy
Legend
Terrible chicken-wing FH!What would you call this?
If not a PD with low tension he’d be just another weak bunter!
I saw myself hitting my FH like that in 2020 and had to change it.
peoplespeace
Professional
Plus it looks like it might be a serve return!
S
Slicehand
Guest
Maria shakkari maybe? I cant remember but her take back looks quite manish
Nik excused his chicken wing FH in response to a comment made about it: "the touring pro’s FH’s and my FH are not different bio mechanically speaking, since I played at the highest level. The difference between my FH compared to the best FH’s in the world (Fed, Rafa, Nole etc.) is that is has less spin."
Actually they are biomechanically different. This FH has little to none forearm pronation/ISR.
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Perhaps a kick serve or some other high bouncing shot
Dragy
Legend
I was kidding obviously. He blasts balls hard and reliably.
I think his FH has most fundamentals. But lacks some polish and perfection you see with most current pros. They do improve technically even well into their pro careers.
I don't like his FH as a model though and won't recommend to copy neither his takeback nor finish.
No doubt it is effective and ugly.
Of course he doesn't want to admit he has a women's forehand.
Digital Atheist
Hall of Fame
I'm guessing you know this because he said it in a video?
Curious
G.O.A.T.
Correct.
