Stringway triple flying clamp vs double clamp
- Thread starter Imren
- Start date
I have tried a similar thing except that I put the starting clamp on L2, then pull tension on L1, R1, R2 and R3. Then I go back to L2 and go out to L4.
I am trying to compensate for a disproportionate amount of tension of the RHS when starting at L1.
I‘m not sure if it’s the right way but it seems to give me a pretty good result.
tennisbike
Professional
What do you use, or how do you know you get a "good result"?
It’s just my subjective assessment.
What I really mean is that it seems logical to do it this way to reduce racket distortion (there’s potential upside) and I haven’t noticed any problems (no obvious downside).
I use Sergetti proportional stringing method.
The best gauge I have is that the racket comes off the machine easily I.e. the racket hasn’t changed shape because all 6 points on my machine undo evenly (require the same effort to undo). When the string job is not good, I noticed some undo easy and others are harder because the racket is deformed in some way.
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
I am finding that using the outsides of the triple clamp to hold the last mains in a 16x19 98 racquet is not working very well. It seems to be twisting a lot more than I would expect from these clamps even though the strings are more in line during tensioning. I have since just used the double instead of the triple, seems to twist less for some reason:
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
@jugheadfla if you don’t mind me asking what is the width of the 2 center spacers in the triple clamp? TIA
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
I think that twisting action is happening because of the width of the center space when clamping only 2 strings.looks like your tie off is at grommet 7 but I’m going there is another tie off at grommet 6. If you skipped the 7th main and did a Yonex loop the clamp would straighten after you tensioned the 7th main. Then you could clamp the 5th, 6th, and 7th mains and there would not be as much twisting. That may be a problem though to tension the 7th main.I am finding that using the outsides of the triple clamp to hold the last mains in a 16x19 98 racquet is not working very well. It seems to be twisting a lot more than I would expect from these clamps even though the strings are more in line during tensioning. I have since just used the double instead of the triple, seems to twist less for some reason:
another option is to hold the 8th main with a starting clamp. After stringing the first few crosses you could then tie off the outer main. The inter-string friction would help keep the clamp from twisting.
PrinceYonex
Semi-Pro
Just wanted to add my impressions here, having recently obtained Stringway triple and double clamps. I have found a similar pattern as some of the others in this thread that the Stringway clamps do a much much better job at resisting drawback than the standard Gamma plastic clamps. They also seem to clamp strings much more efficiently than the Gamma clamps -- that is, I don't need to apply as much pressure with the Stringways in order to clamp without slippage. So they are gentler on the strings. Finally, I have also found that the tension right off the stringing machine is higher when using the Stringways than it was with the Gammas, much closer to reference tension as measured by Racquettune. In that sense, it seems easier to be consistent and accurate with the stringing process. You don't have to use a higher than intended tension to achieve the stringbed stiffness that you want.
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
this is a good idea and I was actually going to try it during my last string job, but I think I need to purchase a third starting clamp if I want to do this. I usually like to use a starting clamp when starting my crosses, so two starting clamps won't do. I really don't like anchoring the starting cross because you never get the proper tension on the first cross when you double pull.
Have never tried a Yonex loop yet, have to go back and watch a video and try it out and see if it works!
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
I tried a Yonex loop with one of my flying clamps it does not work well IMO if you are not using a CP machine. You will have to tension a string that is either going around over your clamp which causes problems. If you use your double clamp I would not clamp the string as close to the frame as you can get it. That causes the strings to pull the clamps apart so only one end actually clamps the string and you end up with a greater chance of the string slipping. IMO your best option is to hold the outer main
with a starting clamp until you have the crosses near the tie off installed. The crosses help to hold the flying clamp better so there is less chance of drawback / twisting.
Could this be because the triple clamp is calibrated for use with 3 strings but you are clamping only 2 strings? Without a third string in the center you are reducing the total force applied to the strings and this would allow more slippage which appears as draw back. Please try clamping with a loose “dummy” string in the center to see if it helps.I am finding that using the outsides of the triple clamp to hold the last mains in a 16x19 98 racquet is not working very well. It seems to be twisting a lot more than I would expect from these clamps even though the strings are more in line during tensioning. I have since just used the double instead of the triple, seems to twist less for some reason:
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
It is because of the radius of the clamp. The wider the spacer in the center the farther apart the 2 string you clamp are. The greater that radius the greater the twisting. That’s why the double clamp twists less.
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jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
I think you are correct, but it seemed like from the pictures from the stringway site and this forum that the triple could be use as a double for the last mains. Doesn't seem to be the case. It does work for wide crosses, but I think that is obvious because of the friction from the previous crosses.
Still , the biggest problem I am having right now is getting the tension in my 8 center mains to be consistent. I haven't found the right combination of using a double for the 2 center mains and then using the triple for the rest. Seems to never be symmetric. @Irvin, any ideas? I might make a video to show how I am doing it so maybe someone is doing it better and can provide some input.
Irvin,
I shared a method that I have been using (earlier in this thread):
"I have tried a similar thing except that I put the starting clamp on L2, then pull tension on L1, R1, R2 and R3. Then I go back to L2 and go out to L4.
I am trying to compensate for a disproportionate amount of tension of the RHS when starting at L1.
I‘m not sure if it’s the right way but it seems to give me a pretty good result."
I should have also mentioned that I am using flying clamps.
I have nowhere near the experience that you do when it comes to stringing.
I have learned a great deal from your posts over the years and would greatly appreciate your opinion (good or bad) of what I suggested, as I value your advice.
Thanks in advance.
I shared a method that I have been using (earlier in this thread):
"I have tried a similar thing except that I put the starting clamp on L2, then pull tension on L1, R1, R2 and R3. Then I go back to L2 and go out to L4.
I am trying to compensate for a disproportionate amount of tension of the RHS when starting at L1.
I‘m not sure if it’s the right way but it seems to give me a pretty good result."
I should have also mentioned that I am using flying clamps.
I have nowhere near the experience that you do when it comes to stringing.
I have learned a great deal from your posts over the years and would greatly appreciate your opinion (good or bad) of what I suggested, as I value your advice.
Thanks in advance.
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Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
There are so many ways to start main it isn’t funny. I tried a method I had not seen before today. I ran in the 2 center mains and started the 2nd main. I clamped the L1 and L2 mains with a flying clamp outside the frame. I then tensioned R1 and clamped the 2 center mains. Then tensioned R2-R4 walking the clamp out. Then I pulled L1 and moved the outer clamp inside the frame. Used the same method to start the crosses. Similar to using a starting clamp. I can make a video if that’s confusing.
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
footing clamps?
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
definitely confusing, but interesting. I think a video is warranted.
I know there are hundreds of ways to start the mains, but it seems like I got better consistency using the gamma doubles for the middle mains than I do with the triples and double. The thing is that it seems like I am getting the dynamic tension after stringing that I am expecting with the Stringways, so does it really matter that I am not getting symmetric main tensions? Those tensions equal out after the crosses are strung correct?
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
Yep, that makes sense now. I'll have to try this!
I think I may have found a better way with my triples to start my mains. I tried it today and it seemed to be more symmetrical. I will try to make a video once I string another racquet and see what you guys think.
*flying
I like that method because it places tension on the LHS first before stringing R1-R4.
My method is similar except that there is also tension on L2. It would be the same as starting that 4ft loop on L2 & L3 instead of L1 & L2.
I am trying to overcome the fact that we get out to R4 when only L1 is tensioned, and this could cause minor frame distortion. Also, in theory, by the time we get out to tensioning L4, it is going to be applying additional tension to R4 as the frame contracts on the LHS.
Not sure if this makes sense?
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
With the Pro-Stringer Claws it is actually possible to set the clamps strings right next to each other so I could have tensioned R1 and R2 then gone right on to L1 and L2. Might be difficult on an 18 main racket though.
I see what you mean. Yes, that would mitigate the problem.
PrinceYonex
Semi-Pro
Thanks for sharing this. Is this any different than just using a starting clamp on one of the center mains and tensioning the other one? Or, in other words, is this essentially just a way of using a floating clamp as a starting clamp?
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
Same thing as using a starting clamp but IMO depending on the flying clamp and how it is adjusted the flying clamp is easier on the string from what I have experienced.
Do I do it correctly? I put one of my starting clamps as close as I can to the throat, clamping one of the mains, then I put the tension on the other main and clamp it with the 2nd flying clamp and then, when I string about 3 times that side, then I put the tension on the main which was clamped to the throat, and then I take that clamp and set it on the head.
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Does anyone else also notice a difference in tension when using the triple clamp clamping wide string gaps, like those outer strings? I find this to be most prevalent in the last string clamped down, where the triple clamp will deform the 2 or 3 strings quite a bit, and thus after tie off, the last string is a little looser than use the Pro Stringer standard or large claw? Using a stringmeter, I've found discrepancies of 1-2lbs, not a huge deal but the last 2 strings show 1-2lbs lower than the other strings. I don't have this issue with the Pro String claws.
Also, the Stringway triple adjustment wheel is pretty easily knocked out of position when locking and releasing, and putting it down. Is it wise to disassemble and put an o-ring to keep the adjustment wheel more rigid?
Also, the Stringway triple adjustment wheel is pretty easily knocked out of position when locking and releasing, and putting it down. Is it wise to disassemble and put an o-ring to keep the adjustment wheel more rigid?
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
If you look up earlier in this thread you will see I brought up this same issue. What I do now is if I have a wider gap I just use the double clamp for it instead of the triple. It seems to twist less in those situations.
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Yes I got the Pro Stringer Large Claw now, which makes it much easier and there's no twisting at all. I think I'm going to dump that String Way Triple clamp now.
PrinceYonex
Semi-Pro
Have you tried using only the two outer clamping sides of the triple clamp for wide spaces -- in other words, using the triple as if it were a wide double clamp? I've found that a useful option especially on some of the outer crosses, where spacing is often wider.
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
The problem is when you do this, especially on the last mains, the string tends to twist far too much when you release tension. Even though stringway shows that they can be used this way, I would beg to differ. See my pictures in post #55
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Yes I have. And because they are 19mm wide in the middle, it pulls or pushes strings that don't fit that gap. That's the nice thing about the claws with the tapered heads, they fit the gap without distortion! I'm not sure how much of the distortion affects the tension, but I noticed during last string after tie off has lower tension, and it affects the 2nd last string slightly too. Using the Pro String large claw, it's not as pronounced. I wish someone had told me about the large claw before I let my daughter buy the Stringway triple. She uses the claws now exclusively.
PrinceYonex
Semi-Pro
Interesting. Perhaps it's because I've been stringing an 18/20 that I haven't noticed such a pronounced distortion on the outside mains. Have you tried raising the tension on the machine for the last main (using a 'knot tension')? Do you find that a slightly lower tension on the last one or two mains has an impact on the overall stringbed stiffness?
PrinceYonex
Semi-Pro
I just went back to look at the photo. That looks pretty significant. Did you sort out a solution? Does raising the tension on the last main help counteract the effect of the distortion on the overall stringbed stiffness and maintain the the tension level on that last main?
jugheadfla
Semi-Pro
Now, instead of using a triple as a double clamp on the last 2 mains, I just use the stringway double instead. There still is a little bit of twist, but not nearly as much as with the triple. I did find that when using the double instead of the triple in this situation that the stringbed tension after stringing was approx .5 lbs closer to reference tension.
Sardines
Hall of Fame
It's on any final string where there is major distortion, mains or cross. I've tried increasing tension on the last pull before tie off, on the odd occasion I hit the top string on a stretched out shot, it's a little more unpredictable. It does affect gut tension more. I wonder if this is natural proportional stringing? haha
meyermanie
New User
Hey Gaz, did you have any issues with the triple clamp on the outer mains like others or are you using the double there? Trying to decide between the Stringway or Pro string claws, as have the same drawback issues.
Sorry to jump in there, but maybe I can help. I've been the using the Stringway triple and double clamps for a while, but had looked at the Pro Stringer Claws as well. Stringing methods aside, the outer mains separation is going to vary across different rackets and you never will really have a perfect clamp for all rackets there. I gave up trying to be a perfect stringer with a drop weight machine and flying clamps. No, I did not move up to an electronic stringer. I just gave up aiming for perfection using less than perfect equipment. Instead I just try for consistency and getting feedback from my kids as they use their rackets. I am not a fan of Stringway as I had a run in with Fred T., but I have to say their clamps just plain work. Great hold with minimal string crushing. The Stringway clamps are very crudely finished and there are some odd design choices, but I would definitely miss not having them. Some of the issues over clamp twisting occur because of clamping strings too deep or unevenly in the jaws. Having one side deeper in the jaws will cause unequal clamping pressure. I try to clamp strings just above the base of the clamp's "fingers" so I can get a sense of how level the string is in the jaw. Sounds more complicated than it is, but since these are flying clamps, it is easier to get the strings uneven in the jaws. For me, I use two triple clamps for the mains (beginning with a starting clamp and a double clamp) and pretty much just the double clamp on the crosses. I will use a triple clamp to bridge the wider top and bottom crosses as needed. You can get around the "wideness" of the clamps next to each other by having one clamp under and one clamp on top. Which brings me to the Pro Stringer Claws. They just seem better suited to use from above as opposed to from below. The angled anvil for the jaws seems like a great idea for adjusting to string separation, but in practice it seems to require too much fiddling to go straight onto the strings. The curvature of the "bottom" edge of the clamping handle also seems to fit better when used from above the strings. The finishing, however, easily embarrasses the Stringway flying clamps. As far as technique, I have settled on a variation of the Yusuki method. I begin using the triple clamps as soon a possible, so that means I go three more on one side of the mains, but I have not seen any signs of damage on Yonex, Volkl, or Wilson rackets. Nothing fancy for my old brain to remember. As far as choosing between the Stringways or the ProStringer claws, I would recommend the Stringways because they just plain work. Gripping three strings allows for less twisting, but also less pressure needed to secure the strings. However using the triple for two widely spaced strings works, but still is never the "right" width. Yes, the Stringways are clunky and crude looking, but I think you'll find they just work extremely well and make the best of a not so ideal situation of having to use flying clamps. Here is a great video from YUlitle that shows how I start (substitute a starting clamp for the flying clamp outside the frame).
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
@Imren you should have purchased the Claws. The M Claws has narrower (and wider) capabilities that the Stringway, while the L Claw has wider (and narrower) capabilities than the Stringway. both models are made with cast aluminum so both have exceptional clamping strength. The Claws have less string distortion unless your string spacing is exactly the distance of the center spacers in the Stringway. The Claws are polished where the Stringway look like they came out of a mood.
Even though I have a machine that uses fixed clamps I use my Claws ocassionally. I never Use my starting clamp outside the frame anymore but use a Claw inside the frame.
Even though I have a machine that uses fixed clamps I use my Claws ocassionally. I never Use my starting clamp outside the frame anymore but use a Claw inside the frame.
meyermanie
New User
That's great mate. Thanks so much. Exactly what I wanted to know. Pretty much got to the same conclusion about chasing perfect, but want to give myself the best chance of reasonable outcomes and consistency given parameters.
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I have to give it to you that the Pro Stringers are very nicely finished. I have tired the 16mm Claw and found myself constantly eyeing every clamping. I just never got into a flow. With my Stringways, I became accustomed to coming in straight and level with leeway as to depth because of the exceptional grip. I know, I know, the Stringway flying clamps just have a sanded surface for grip; but grip it does and it is so easy to resurface the grip area when needed. As to string deflection, I feel its just going to happen when clamping two strings together; so I try not to obsess about it. I think the real difference in our preferences comes from what we do most of our clamping with. I do all of my clamping with flying clamps, so I need more of an all-around clamp. If I mainly used fixed clamps or clamped from above (as in approaching the strings with a rocking motion), I might feel differently. My Stringway flying clamps work exceptionally well for their purpose with minimal string damage, are easy to adjust on the fly, and are easy to maintain. To be fair, I do believe the Pro Stringer Claws are ideally suited to the Pro Stringer system. What an innovative piece of engineering that is!
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
@Imren agreed when I first started using the Claws on my X-STRINGER it took a little getting used to it. Because the gripping area is angled to allow clamping at various distances you can just go straight up. It does not take long to get accustomed to it though. Only problem are now is a wide spacing near the top or bottom but doesn’t take long. Better than the clamps that came with the X-STRINGER.
This is racquet dependent - the Stringway triple fits perfectly on the top and bottom crosses on my Wilson 6.1 95 16x18s, and on the bottom cross of my Dunlop CX200s.
The finish ... eh. I had a chat with their 'support' about my triple that doesn't close smoothly and the suggestion was to adjust the guide pins with a hammer. I eventually found another adjustment that helped but ... not happy. There's a definite aura of 'made-in-someone's-garage' with these things.
meyermanie
New User
Irvin, aside from the variable width clamping/less displacement benefit, do the Claws noticeably reduce drawback issues?
Irvin
Talk Tennis Guru
Compared to other flying clamps they are better but there is drawback from twisting. I purchased 2 M and one large. I generally hold the outer main with a L Claw and leave the previous M Claw on the 2 string inside the outer main to reduce drawback. If you string with an ATW and tie off the top cross and a lower cross they is very little drawback.
Whoa. Your clamp plates are way way too far apart. At that distance, you will crush the pins that engage into the plates when you try to close the clamp. From the video ,you can see a larger gap in the outer plate when the clamp is fully closed. That needs to be adjusted. The second triple clamp in your video appears to be properly set. The plates just need to be far enough for your largest gauge string to enter easily. The center gap will be held shut by spring tension, so add a half a gauge more distance when adjusting the plates. There are two adjustments. The thumbscrew which you will adjust pretty regularly as you change strings, and the bottom hex bolt with the nylock nut. Your plates are way too apart so first you will need to adjust the bottom bolt and nut. For the nylock nut, you will need a thin wall 7mm driver. The hex bolt is a 3mm. It will spin freely, so you will need to hold both sides while tightening. Tighten this until the pins are just entering their corresponding holes in the plates. The edges of the pins have to be far enough into the holes to allow them to feed properly. The only time you will need to take a SMALL hammer to these is if you have bent them. Looking at the pins, they may appear askew, but they have been hand "tuned" at the factory so best to leave them be. Once you have done this, you can adjust the thumb screw to accommodate your string. The center gap will stay closed until you press a string into it. A spring is holding the inner plates closed so that is the way it is supposed to operate. Now try to clamp it onto strings and adjust as needed using the thumb screw. The bottom screw will only need to be re-adjusted as the clamps wear. When shipped, the triple clamp should have come with the bottom bolt already set. If you need to get service, let your distributor do the leg work. Trying to "communicate" with Fred in the Netherlands will send you in circles. There is some really impressive engineering in Stringway stringers, but they all seem handmade; needing adjustments hear and there. Some people like that, some people don't. These are just clamps, so they don't get the same attention as their stringing machines; but having used them for a while, I would buy them again if I lost mine.
liftordie
Hall of Fame
@Stringway Official The website shop is closed... Where can I buy your flying clamps??
In the USA I believe the sole distributor is Alpha Racquet Sports in Austin, TX. The owner only gets what he's given, so you may need to call he to get the clamps you need. Online, he shows no clamps in stock. Alpha Racquet Sports 7208 McNeil Dr. #207 Austin, TX 78729 Toll Free 1.800.922.9024 Local 512.250.1499 . Stringway clamps - USA. You can buy from the Netherlands; but depending on where you are located, Fred will not be shy in letting you know how much shipping costs. There are also other distrubutors depending on where you live.
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