silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Did anybody else notice a widespread ratings adjustment in their section on tennis record? For eastern 3.5 and 4.0 men, almost everyone I know was just adjusted down 0.15 to 0.30 on tennis record a few days ago.
Official 2022 ratings thread.
- Thread starter J011yroger
- Start date
KamehamehaBackhand
Rookie
I noticed that for my current section and prior section. I actually think they made a change a couple months ago, because it seemed like every week my and others ratings seemed to be ticking up and up, almost like there was a circular reference or something. So I think they may have then reverted back to their prior methodology.
Specifically for me a week+ ago I had a match rating for a match against a self-rate, who went on to have 3+ matches over the course of the season. So I think they maybe were trying to go back and add match ratings against self-rates, but then that became a circular reference. Now it's back to N/A for that match this week, along with nearly everyone's ratings going back down a fair amount.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
I hope the lower ratings are accurate please....
Vox Rationis
Professional
It was the opposite up until the last few days I guess. I've noticed most sections slowly going higher and higher over the last couple months. A good 0.15 on average. But I just checked again and everyone's ratings reverted back to what they were awhile ago so like Goku just said maybe they reverted back to an old methodology.
Mine has gone up, and I don't like it. But in my last match my opponent was throwing games left and right and my partner was too foolish to realize what was going on. So it probably really hurt me.
I need to go back down to 3.5
I've wondered that too. They color them green, which is the same color they use for results from leagues that don't count for NTRP ratings. For those "green league" results on my list, they rated some of them but not others, for no obvious reason.
But tournaments do count for NTRP in many areas, including mine, so it is puzzling why they don't treat them like eligible league matches.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Probably because each section treats tournaments differently, they just universally separate them
The same is true for leagues, for example some sections count Tri-Level results for NTRP and some don't. I think TR does manage to track those differences by each area, based on their color scheme. Maybe doing the same for tournaments was just too much additional work to figure out.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
schmke
Legend
Good questions. I think the USTA has a cut-off date when they calculate ratings, and whatever scores are recorded for the matches that count on that date is what is used.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Does anyone know the cutoff date this year when you need to have 3 matches by to get a computer rating for next year?
schmke
Legend
It has usually been the Sunday of the last day of Adult Nationals. But last year it was the Sunday of the last day of Mixed Nationals. So take your pick 10/30 or 11/13.
Several weeks ago on TR, match ratings were assigned to the "S" matches. Qualified "S" tainted matches are included at year-end; hence assigning match ratings made sense to me. All ratings changed as a result.
Then, after a couple of weeks, this change was undone. The self-rate tainted matches were again assigned an "S" and disregarded in the calculations.
Of course, I don't know if any of the calculations are accurate. I also don't know how much impact the inclusion of the "S" matches has on ratings. I have eight matches that aren't counted. I suspect the inclusion of these matches could move my rating by .02 - .05. But TR bumped my rating my approx. 0.18 with the inclusion!
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
If you are self rated with rating around 3.3 on October 31, and your announced new rating on December 1st is 3.5C, can you still get strikes and DQed to 4.0 between December 1st and January 1st, when the new computer rating takes effect?
If you'll be playing league matches in December that could generate strikes, that'd have to be an early-start 2023 "USTA Adult" league, right?
It's an interesting question. My guess is that if you've played enough rating-eligible matches by the cutoff date to get your first C-rating, then you'd have to immune from DQ strikes during early-start leagues. But I don't know.
There are Sections where Fall League extends into mid-December, and these are not early-start leagues. Intermountain and SoCal, for instance.
As of today, specific "S" matches have again been assigned match ratings. Thus, these rated matches are calculated in the TR rating calcs.
Yes but those leagues cannot generate strikes toward DQ, by my understanding.
I still see 1 match vs a S rated player not being assigned a match rating and included in my TR calcs. The S rated player only played 2 league (men's Adult 18+) matches in April and June. Does that mean he didn't play the minimum required matches to garner a dynamic rating? I thought it was 2 not 3?
Lord Of The Strings
New User
Purely anecdotal but my rating went up .16 (3.43 to 3.59) during the great boost that lasted a month...then went back down to where it originally was (3.43), then went up again to like 3.51 on the most recent update that included some S matches being assigned ratings, then updated again today and all those matches no longer have ratings assigned and it's back to 3.43. I mostly just want to know if I'm getting bumped to 4.0, but I suppose TR was never going to be super accurate since my section includes tournament play in ratings but TR doesn't. Oh well.
In addition to the "S" match inclusion/removal cycle, I've seen dNTRP results at specific time points that made no sense. It appears that "plug figures" are being used, or the algo is seriously flawed. I don't have much faith in TR ratings on an absolute basis. But, on a relative basis, if all comps have a sufficient number of valid data points, the ratings provide some value to me.
Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
TR is underrating a lot of players, but we have been able to observe TR for several years now and underrating is the rule rather than the exception.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
How much did they underrate by? Were 3.3 TR rated people getting bumped to 4.0?
I think TR had me at like 3.4 last year and I got bumped up to 4.0 and outside the appeal range. My buddy was a 3.48 on TR and was able to appeal down(but @schmke ) had him slightly under the bump.
I went winless this year and still don't think I have a shot at being bumped down
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Did you have good playoff results?I think TR had me at like 3.4 last year and I got bumped up to 4.0 and outside the appeal range. My buddy was a 3.48 on TR and was able to appeal down(but @schmke ) had him slightly under the bump.
I went winless this year and still don't think I have a shot at being bumped down
Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
We have seen players with a TR rating of X.25 and X.75 get bumped in the past few years. Really just depends.
Yeah last year I went .500 at southern sectionals. My buddy went 1.000 at southern sectionals though then crushed it this year to 40+ nationals.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
I think TR heard what you said. They just moved a lot of people up by 0.11 spontaneously.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Anybody hear if the rating season cutoff is November 14 like last year or if it changed this year?
Justagamefool
New User
11/13
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Did they say what source or authority they got the date from?
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Maybe some of the usta officials are intentionally spreading misinformation to avoid tanking
schmke
Legend
Some are from National, others from Section Coordinators who say they checked with National. So take your pick!
Whether misinformation, miscommunication, or misunderstanding, something is being missed.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
If their is miscommunication, they'll probably have to use November 14th then, to allow more people to get computer ratings. If official told me November 14th so I planned for some of my guys to get their 3rd match in early November, then it turned out to be October 31, I'd be upset.
ncgator
Rookie
Seems like it would be 11/13 since that is the date for completing all the Nationals tournaments- 40+ Mixed is that weekend.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
In previous years, 2019 and earlier, it was October 31 even though mixed went into mid November.
schmke
Legend
Correct, well sort of. In past years it was the Sunday of the last Adult (which is usually 55+) Nationals which was generally around the end of October.
I'm not sure exactly why they switched to end of Mixed Nationals last year, but my guess is that compressed the schedule to get the ratings done/reviewed and they wanted more time and so are reverting back to 10/30 this year, but perhaps haven't communicated that very well and so many staff are following last year's model and saying 11/13. Or, the 10/30 I was told was incorrect.
Results from Mixed (MX) matches are not included in Adult League (M or W) ratings. Hence, it seems logical that the Adult rating season ends when the Adult Nationals end (October 30th 2022). But, last year, they did things differently. Of course, last year was unique because the 2020 & 21 seasons were combined because of the lack of play during the pandemic.
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As of yesterday afternoon, October 31st, our LC said the season would run through November 13th. I had previously inquired about the end date and received no response. But things suddenly changed yesterday (and too late for me to benefit from it). As expected, the year-end ratings will be available on December 1st or earlier.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Why is it too late for you?
Given my travel schedule and factors out of my control, I don't have any more playing opportunities. If I had known earlier, I could have made changes. The cloak-and-dagger ways of the USTA Adult League are annoying.
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Then, didn't you plan your playing around an October 30 deadline?
kylebarendrick
Professional
Mixed matches are used to create a mixed-exclusive rating if they player did not participate in the gendered (M/W) adult leagues.
schmke
Legend
I noted earlier that I was told 10/30 is the cut-off, but pretty much everyone else I've heard from said they were told 11/13.
What I heard today is that 10/30 is the cut-off date for matches to count, but 11/13 is the date by which matches have to be entered into TennisLink. Presumably this is the real answer and why two different dates are being mentioned, but if this is true, it seems the meaning of 11/13 was misunderstood and was communicated as the cut-off date incorrectly.
What I heard today is that 10/30 is the cut-off date for matches to count, but 11/13 is the date by which matches have to be entered into TennisLink. Presumably this is the real answer and why two different dates are being mentioned, but if this is true, it seems the meaning of 11/13 was misunderstood and was communicated as the cut-off date incorrectly.
schmke
Legend
Perhaps plan to be upset!
silverwyvern4
Semi-Pro
Well just to be safe, I'll continue playing my matches left-handed until 11/13 then.
cloak-and-dagger......
Lord Of The Strings
New User
As an update to this anecdote. In today's TR update, my rating randomly bumped up approx. .08 and all my teammates/friends either stayed the same, went down a touch or went up a touch (.01-.02). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
