2004 French Open proves how vastly overrated Federer is on clay

grafselesfan

grafselesfan

Banned
Gustavo Kuerten was the one to prove how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is at the 2004 French Open. Kuerten was way past his prime, his career virtually ruined by a major hip injury late in 2001. He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour. Yet a prime Federer allowed a hip crippled Kuerten way past his prime to destroy him in straight sets in the 3rd round of 2004 French Open. The same Kuerten who a year earlier couldnt even beat Tommy Robredo, and that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian. That just shows how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is. If he lost 6-4, 6-4, 6-4 to hip crippled Kuerten he would have no shot to win even a single match vs prime Kuerten on clay. That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
 
zacinnc78

zacinnc78

Professional
who does that prove anything to though...that is the question (other than you and some other bitter sampras fans)
 
L

Lotto

Professional
No it doesn't. Federer was only at the beginning in 2004.....he was just about to enter his prime....Federers prime years were 2004 US Open-2007 Aussie Open in terms of both standard of tennis and titles in 2006. Everyone has off days....nobodies invincible....even if Kuerten was injured he's still a good claycourter....who did Sampras lose to in the 1st round of Wimbledon in 2002 like?? I know he was past his prime but he's still considered the greatest grass courter of all time and ONE YEAR earlier he lost in the quarters while going for the 5 in a row.....so no lame excuses please....Federers obviously better on clay then Sampras, he has a Roland Garros, as couple of masters and wins over one of the greatest clay courter of all time...this thread is an epic fail, it proves nothing.
 
Speranza

Speranza

Hall of Fame
To the O P, I'll drop off a stack of hay for you.

When you get a chance, examine a few straws and see which ones would be best for clutching at.

Doh, how silly of me, like you need the practice.... :oops:
 
pame

pame

Hall of Fame
grafselesfan, you sound like one of those judges on the panel of the Spanish inquisition who kept insisting to Galileo that the earth does not move.. lol
 
pame

pame

Hall of Fame
Speranza said:
To the O P, I'll drop off a stack of hay for you.

When you get a chance, examine a few straws and see which ones would be best for clutching at.

Doh, how silly of me, like you need the practice.... :oops:
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ROFL... If I'd seen your post before posting I wouldn't have bothered. You said it so much better than I did.
 
L

lessthanjake

Semi-Pro
Federer's prime on clay started later than his prime elsewhere IMO. I don't think he was in his prime on clay in 2004.

Regardless, though, one match really does not show that much. This is especially true when Federer won their other meeting on clay in 2002 when Federer was worse and Kuerten was better. It is clear from that fact that Federer was capable of beating Kuerten in 2004 and just played a bad match against a player he should have and could have beaten. These things happen to every player, though they happen less to Federer than any other player in tennis history.


He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour.
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Kuerten was 28th seed at that tournament, which is top 30. He DID end the year 40th, but you'd be an idiot to think that Kuerten wasn't top 30 in the world at the time ON CLAY. Kuerten was a clay court specialist, so he might have been 40th in the world overall, but he was still top 10-15 in the world on clay; I guarantee it.

that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian
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Nalbandian is a VERY good clay courter. He has twice made the semis of Roland Garros. Why do you act like it is lame to lose to him on clay?

That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
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You are just a troll. Besides Nadal, Federer has DOMINATED all the great clay court players of his era on clay: Ferrero, Gaudio, Coria, Moya, Gonzalez, Davydenko. Federer is 18-0 against those guys on clay. He is 3-1 against Nalbandian. 2-1 against Djokovic. 2-0 against Del Potro. 2-0 against Verdasco. 3-0 against Ferrer. 3-0 against Monfils.

The fact that he is 1-1 against Kuerten does not change the fact that the only player who has been able to consistently get the better of Federer on clay is the possible clay GOAT Nadal. Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Rios, and Corretja were NOT better on clay than Ferrero, Coria, Gaudio, and Djokovic (against whom Federer is a combined 9-1 on clay). You listed Moya, but Federer dominated Moya while Moya was playing as well as ever. So I really don't think Federer would have had a problem with the players you listed.

But would prime Kuerten have been better than Federer on clay? Probably. But what's your point? Kuerten is one of the top 5 clay courters ever; it's really no shame to be worse than him on clay.
 
Speranza

Speranza

Hall of Fame
pame said:
ROFL... If I'd seen your post before posting I wouldn't have bothered. You said it so much better than I did.
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I disagree! I think you might have sent the OP into more of a state; I'd guess that GSFan is checking on Google right now whether the earth really does move..........
 
J

joeri888

G.O.A.T.
Another laughable thread to make Federer look bad.

The people desperately trying to prove Fed is the GOAT are sometimes annoying, but this is just on another level. I think threads like these show even better what a great champion Federer is.
 
D

dropshot winner

Hall of Fame
There're worse things than losing to a 3-time Roland Garros champion on clay.

Everyone has bad days, even prime-Kuerten was just one point away to lose to Russel in RG 2001.
 
J

joeri888

G.O.A.T.
Peche said:
You don't want the truth, simple. Federer isn't as good on clay as all his supporters make it out.
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Federer isn't a clay legend, but he's far superior to any current player except for Nadal. While I might be slightly exaggerating Fed's achievements and potential, you are HUGELY underrating it all the time, maximo. You can keep hating the guy, or simply appreciate that he is a great player, and hope that one day Murray will beat a tennis legend in a Slam final (which is not unlikely and would be a great honor for Andy)
 
P

Peche

Banned
joeri888 said:
Federer isn't a clay legend, but he's far superior to any current player except for Nadal. While I might be slightly exaggerating Fed's achievements and potential, you are HUGELY underrating it all the time, maximo. You can keep hating the guy, or simply appreciate that he is a great player, and hope that one day Murray will beat a tennis legend in a Slam final (which is not unlikely and would be a great honor for Andy)
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Oh yes! all fans of Federer never underrate Sampras's achievements . :roll:

You are very opinionated and never sit on the fence in any discussions regarding Federer.
 
GasquetGOAT

GasquetGOAT

Hall of Fame
This thread proves how immensely stupid grafselesfan is as a poster

This thread proves how immensely stupid grafselesfan is as a poster.
 
J

joeri888

G.O.A.T.
Peche said:
Oh yes! all fans of Federer never underrate Sampras's achievements . :roll:

You are very opinionated and never sit on the fence in any discussions regarding Federer.
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Of course I have an opinion. Also, I don't underrate Sampras's performances I think. What other Fedfans do is their business, and I'm also quite often annoyed by some of the things fellow Fedfans say.
 
stormholloway

stormholloway

Legend
Didn't Federer teach Kuerten a lesson in Hamburg 2002? Federer was far from his prime and Kuerten was still playing well it seemed.

Losing to a 3 time former FO champion is far from an embarrassment, unlike this thread.
 
T

tintin

Professional
is there any clips of the former GOAT who couldn't make the FO finals being humiliated in the French capital for us to see? compare his highness to the "overrated" Federer,PLEASE!
 
kishnabe

kishnabe

Talk Tennis Guru
grafselesfan said:
Gustavo Kuerten was the one to prove how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is at the 2004 French Open. Kuerten was way past his prime, his career virtually ruined by a major hip injury late in 2001. He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour. Yet a prime Federer allowed a hip crippled Kuerten way past his prime to destroy him in straight sets in the 3rd round of 2004 French Open. The same Kuerten who a year earlier couldnt even beat Tommy Robredo, and that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian. That just shows how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is. If he lost 6-4, 6-4, 6-4 to hip crippled Kuerten he would have no shot to win even a single match vs prime Kuerten on clay. That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
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Sorry but that was year 2004, this is year 2009. Federer improved each year, sure he might have lost to kuerten and i do agree prime kuerten would beat prome federer on clay. But federer is an oustanding clay couter even if his french open titles don't prove it his Hamburg master series titles say something else. Plus being a finalist at rome, monte carlo and the french open many times is a clear proof. Kalfenikov was lucky to win his french open, Moya was good but he only lasted a while. Corretja was good. Rios is rather overated or rather mentally weak. Federer on the other hand has ability, tactics and knows how to use the court, mentally strong and is adept.
 
cknobman

cknobman

Legend
This thread proves how lame the OP really is.

The glory days of the past are gone.

LET. IT. GO.

The 2009 Wimby exo of Graf-Clijsters proves how overrated Graf was on grass. I mean did you see how she got stomped by Kim???? How pathetic.:rolleyes:
 
ubermeyer

ubermeyer

Hall of Fame
he sucked on clay then, he was only focusing on grass/HC. then he trained and got better on clay over time. now only Nadal can beat him in the FO.
 
deltox

deltox

Hall of Fame
grafselesfan said:
Gustavo Kuerten was the one to prove how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is at the 2004 French Open. Kuerten was way past his prime, his career virtually ruined by a major hip injury late in 2001. He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour. Yet a prime Federer allowed a hip crippled Kuerten way past his prime to destroy him in straight sets in the 3rd round of 2004 French Open. The same Kuerten who a year earlier couldnt even beat Tommy Robredo, and that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian. That just shows how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is. If he lost 6-4, 6-4, 6-4 to hip crippled Kuerten he would have no shot to win even a single match vs prime Kuerten on clay. That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
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it just goes to show how tight federer has that goat claim held. haters like you spend HOURS and HOURS each and every day trying to come up with little things to make it not so, which in the end only solidifies his resolve over that title you dont want him to have so badly.

moral of the story is, get over it.
 
TheFifthSet

TheFifthSet

Legend
grafselesfan said:
Gustavo Kuerten was the one to prove how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is at the 2004 French Open. Kuerten was way past his prime, his career virtually ruined by a major hip injury late in 2001. He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour. Yet a prime Federer allowed a hip crippled Kuerten way past his prime to destroy him in straight sets in the 3rd round of 2004 French Open. The same Kuerten who a year earlier couldnt even beat Tommy Robredo, and that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian. That just shows how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is. If he lost 6-4, 6-4, 6-4 to hip crippled Kuerten he would have no shot to win even a single match vs prime Kuerten on clay. That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
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Hahahahahahahaha. There it is.

I hope you're savouring Pete's lone Semi. 'Cause that's probably all he would have ever gotten, in any era.


Awwwwwwww. :(:(:(:(
 
L

lessthanjake

Semi-Pro
Peche said:
You don't want the truth, simple. Federer isn't as good on clay as all his supporters make it out.
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1 RG Title
3 RG Runner Up
1 RG Semi-finalist
5 Clay Masters Series Titles
6 Clay Masters Series Runner up
Ridiculously good record against all players on clay except Nadal
Only person to beat Nadal on clay twice

Federer is actually pretty godly on clay.
 
F

federerGOAT

Rookie
Prime Fed on clay (2005-2007) would crush Kuerten. Does anyone remember the bagel Kuerten received in Hamburg 2002? Fed is superior in every aspect of the game.

The only player I would put above Fed on clay is Nadal. If not for Nadal, Fed would be a 4 time French Open Champion with numerous master's titles.
 
TheFifthSet

TheFifthSet

Legend
federerGOAT said:
Prime Fed on clay (2005-2007) would crush Kuerten. Does anyone remember the bagel Kuerten received in Hamburg 2002? Fed is superior in every aspect of the game.

The only player I would put above Fed on clay is Nadal. If not for Nadal, Fed would be a 4 time French Open Champion with numerous master's titles.
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Don't stoop to grafselesfans level.
 
J

joeri888

G.O.A.T.
federerGOAT said:
Prime Fed on clay (2005-2007) would crush Kuerten. Does anyone remember the bagel Kuerten received in Hamburg 2002? Fed is superior in every aspect of the game.

The only player I would put above Fed on clay is Nadal. If not for Nadal, Fed would be a 4 time French Open Champion with numerous master's titles.
Click to expand...

The last is true, but the former is ridiculous. Prime Kuerten would be a favourite against Prime Federer on clay, although I think Fed would def. win 1 out of 4 FO's if Kuerten was there instead of Nadal.
 
drwood

drwood

Professional
grafselesfan said:
Gustavo Kuerten was the one to prove how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is at the 2004 French Open. Kuerten was way past his prime, his career virtually ruined by a major hip injury late in 2001. He was no longer top 30 caliber and struggling to win matches consistently on tour. Yet a prime Federer allowed a hip crippled Kuerten way past his prime to destroy him in straight sets in the 3rd round of 2004 French Open. The same Kuerten who a year earlier couldnt even beat Tommy Robredo, and that very French Open couldnt beat David Nalbandian. That just shows how vastly overrated a clay courter Federer is. If he lost 6-4, 6-4, 6-4 to hip crippled Kuerten he would have no shot to win even a single match vs prime Kuerten on clay. That also proves he is even weaker on clay then even those players who had an outside shot of beating prime Kuerten on clay- Kafelnikov, Medvedev, Moya, Corretja, Rios, and many others. Heck I am not sure if he even better than Sampras on clay anymore.
Click to expand...

Federer lost to a has-been at the 2004 French, and Sampras lost to a never-was at the 2002 Wimbledon (George Bastl). Therefore Sampras is vastly overrated on grass...heck, I'm not sure if he's even better than Hewitt on grass anymore.

We could go on and on with stupid, nonsensical, trolling threads like this, or we could actually get into serious discussion without unnecessary childish bashing. Shame on you GSF, you're better than this.
 
F

fps

Legend
drwood said:
Shame on you GSF, you're better than this.
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Are you sure??

I don't see how Federer is overrated on clay. He won the French Open, sure, but does that make him overrated? I don't think the OP understands what "overrated" means, which makes what follows not worth reading.
 
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