steelcity32
Rookie
I want Federer to win for that number 1 to be secured, but at the same time Fedfans will be in full blown circlejerk mode if he does and I don't think I can stomach that.
2019 ATP Final RR: [2] Novak Djokovic vs [3] Roger Federer
- Thread starter Feather
- Start date
Pheasant
Legend
I give Federer a 5% chance of beating Djoker today. If Federer shows up in good form, he has a slight chance.
Let's take a look at Federer vs Djoker since 2018:
2019 WI: Federer should have won this match. Federer broke Djoker 7 times, and Djoker broke Fed only 3 times. Federer scored 14 more points than Djoker. I've never heard of somebody out-breaking somebody 7-3, yet still losing. But that's what going 0-3 in tiebreakers will do. Quite honestly, I'm far more upset about Fed going 0-3 in tiebreakers than the blown 40-15. Federer was extremely competitive here. But he failed in the clutch department multiple times. And FYI, my takeaway here is 0-3 in tiebreakers, not 40-15.
2018 Paris SF: Federer wasn't broken the entire match while he broke Djoker once. However, Federer lost both tiebreakers here. Federer was definitely in this match as well. Federer played really well. But he still couldn't out-clutch Djoker when it counted. Fed was 0-2 in tiebreakers in this match.
2018 Cincy: A horrendous version of Federer showed up here. An extemely rusty Stan should have won against Fed. He choked. An injured Goffin pushed Fed to a tiebreak, then retired in the 2nd set at 1-1. Thankfully, Djoker didn't play all that great in a 6-4, 6-4 win. Federer was absolutely horrendous this whole tourney. This version of Federer could show up today. If he does, then expect breadsticks.
Fed's loss of speed this year is accelerating. Federer looks extremely slow on the court. I really noticed that watching him play Thiem. And Fed no longer has a cannon forehand to slug the younger players off of the court, which is why we see Federer losing more than he wins against guys like Zverev and Thiem.
Federer will need to serve like a boss while being extremely clutch against Djoker to have a chance.
Let's take a look at Federer vs Djoker since 2018:
2019 WI: Federer should have won this match. Federer broke Djoker 7 times, and Djoker broke Fed only 3 times. Federer scored 14 more points than Djoker. I've never heard of somebody out-breaking somebody 7-3, yet still losing. But that's what going 0-3 in tiebreakers will do. Quite honestly, I'm far more upset about Fed going 0-3 in tiebreakers than the blown 40-15. Federer was extremely competitive here. But he failed in the clutch department multiple times. And FYI, my takeaway here is 0-3 in tiebreakers, not 40-15.
2018 Paris SF: Federer wasn't broken the entire match while he broke Djoker once. However, Federer lost both tiebreakers here. Federer was definitely in this match as well. Federer played really well. But he still couldn't out-clutch Djoker when it counted. Fed was 0-2 in tiebreakers in this match.
2018 Cincy: A horrendous version of Federer showed up here. An extemely rusty Stan should have won against Fed. He choked. An injured Goffin pushed Fed to a tiebreak, then retired in the 2nd set at 1-1. Thankfully, Djoker didn't play all that great in a 6-4, 6-4 win. Federer was absolutely horrendous this whole tourney. This version of Federer could show up today. If he does, then expect breadsticks.
Fed's loss of speed this year is accelerating. Federer looks extremely slow on the court. I really noticed that watching him play Thiem. And Fed no longer has a cannon forehand to slug the younger players off of the court, which is why we see Federer losing more than he wins against guys like Zverev and Thiem.
Federer will need to serve like a boss while being extremely clutch against Djoker to have a chance.
Poisoned Slice
Bionic Poster
Excite.
D
Deleted member 629564
Guest
Thiem loses in 2 against Berrettini. His game W/L ratio drops to 51.9%.
Almost for sure the winner of Djokovic-Federer match grabs 1st place in group B.
The only way for Thiem to recover 1st place is Fed's win in tight three sets.
Almost for sure the winner of Djokovic-Federer match grabs 1st place in group B.
The only way for Thiem to recover 1st place is Fed's win in tight three sets.
luiz_gustavo
Hall of Fame
No, in case of a two men draw, what counts the most is the match they played and in this case Thiem got the best of both Federer and Djokovic. He has already won the group since his win against Djokovic.
Pheasant
Legend
I give Federer a 5% chance of beating Djoker today. If Federer shows up in good form, he has a slight chance.
Let's take a look at Federer vs Djoker since 2018:
2019 WI: Federer should have won this match. Federer broke Djoker 7 times, and Djoker broke Fed only 3 times. Federer scored 14 more points than Djoker. I've never heard of somebody out-breaking somebody 7-3, yet still losing. But that's what going 0-3 in tiebreakers will do. Quite honestly, I'm far more upset about Fed going 0-3 in tiebreakers than the blown 40-15. Federer was extremely competitive here. But he failed in the clutch department multiple times. And FYI, my takeaway here is 0-3 in tiebreakers, not 40-15.
2018 Paris SF: Federer wasn't broken the entire match while he broke Djoker once. However, Federer lost both tiebreakers here. Federer was definitely in this match as well. Federer played really well. But he still couldn't out-clutch Djoker when it counted. Fed was 0-2 in tiebreakers in this match.
2018 Cincy: A horrendous version of Federer showed up here. An extemely rusty Stan should have won against Fed. He choked. An injured Goffin pushed Fed to a tiebreak, then retired in the 2nd set at 1-1. Thankfully, Djoker didn't play all that great in a 6-4, 6-4 win. Federer was absolutely horrendous this whole tourney. This version of Federer could show up today. If he does, then expect breadsticks.
Fed's loss of speed this year is accelerating. Federer looks extremely slow on the court. I really noticed that watching him play Thiem. And Fed no longer has a cannon forehand to slug the younger players off of the court, which is why we see Federer losing more than he wins against guys like Zverev and Thiem.
Federer will need to serve like a boss while being extremely clutch against Djoker to have a chance.
Let's take a look at Federer vs Djoker since 2018:
2019 WI: Federer should have won this match. Federer broke Djoker 7 times, and Djoker broke Fed only 3 times. Federer scored 14 more points than Djoker. I've never heard of somebody out-breaking somebody 7-3, yet still losing. But that's what going 0-3 in tiebreakers will do. Quite honestly, I'm far more upset about Fed going 0-3 in tiebreakers than the blown 40-15. Federer was extremely competitive here. But he failed in the clutch department multiple times. And FYI, my takeaway here is 0-3 in tiebreakers, not 40-15.
2018 Paris SF: Federer wasn't broken the entire match while he broke Djoker once. However, Federer lost both tiebreakers here. Federer was definitely in this match as well. Federer played really well. But he still couldn't out-clutch Djoker when it counted. Fed was 0-2 in tiebreakers in this match.
2018 Cincy: A horrendous version of Federer showed up here. An extemely rusty Stan should have won against Fed. He choked. An injured Goffin pushed Fed to a tiebreak, then retired in the 2nd set at 1-1. Thankfully, Djoker didn't play all that great in a 6-4, 6-4 win. Federer was absolutely horrendous this whole tourney. This version of Federer could show up today. If he does, then expect breadsticks.
Fed's loss of speed this year is accelerating. Federer looks extremely slow on the court. I really noticed that watching him play Thiem. And Fed no longer has a cannon forehand to slug the younger players off of the court, which is why we see Federer losing more than he wins against guys like Zverev and Thiem.
Federer will need to serve like a boss while being extremely clutch against Djoker to have a chance.
Pheasant
Legend
Thiem has clinched the group, due to his wins over Djoker and Federer. Federer and Djoker are playing for the #2 seed of the group.
PeoplesChamp
Legend
Antonio Puente
Hall of Fame
YE #1? It's in the bag.
Fed always comes up huge in big matches against elite competition. Lol
Feather
Legend
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
Oh, but Fed fans stomach the tired 40-15 posts three hundreds times daily here.
That's the biggest circle jerk cycle ever seen here.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
5% is way too small, make it 25% to be more realistic. Someone like Ryan Harrison has a 5% chance of beating Djokovic, Fed is considerably more accomplished, to put it mildly.
Federer has been serving excruciatingly badly here this week. His first serve speed is oftentimes 110 MPH, which is a sitting duck for anyone, especially Djokovic. Annacone was puzzled why the serve has been so slow and predictable this event. If Fed serves well, all bets are off.
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beast of mallorca
G.O.A.T.
This will be a massacre by Djokovic, beating Chokerer in straight sets.
C'mon Djoker, pulverize that Big nose
C'mon Djoker, pulverize that Big nose
megamind
Legend
I Am Finnish
Bionic Poster
But if Fedr beats Djokovic than Nadal gets the YEThis will be a massacre by Djokovic, beating Chokerer in straight sets.
C'mon Djoker, pulverize that Big nose
Yugram
Legend
This will be a massacre by Djokovic, beating Chokerer in straight sets.
C'mon Djoker, pulverize that Big nose
TearTheRoofOff
G.O.A.T.
And slice extremely well, imo.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Are you a Nadal fan? If you are then you should want Federer to win today.This will be a massacre by Djokovic, beating Chokerer in straight sets.
C'mon Djoker, pulverize that Big nose
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Enceladus
Legend
No worries, Djoker is a man of steel. In the USO 2015 final, Novak managed to win despite massive pro-Fed support. And this gave rise to this excellent reaction:
swordtennis
G.O.A.T.
A true Nadal fan would know BOM is one of the best Nadal fans.
Yugram
Legend
The chances that he makes it through RR are around 20-25% tomorrow, so not that great for us. But if we try to find something positive, then oh well, do we really want him to face Djokovic on this tournament, in this form? Rhetorical question, no?
So I guess all what’s left is to take additional 200 points, hope someone beats Djokovic and enjoy the rest till AO.
Born_to_slice
Legend
I remember that but I think it's harder for him to endure crowd unfairness these days. Makes matches worse too. Just unhealthy atmosphere.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
If only Zverev could beat Tsitsipas. It would be a different story. I don't think anybody is beating Djokovic here. He gets the YE#1 as a gift.
Pheasant
Legend
You are probably right. But right now, this feels like when Lendl beat old man Connors the last 14 times that they played(or was it 17; I forget now). When watching Connors play Lendl, I felt like Connors didn't have a chance once 1985 rolled around. By then, Jimmy was 32-33 years old and was far too slow to hang with an ATG like Lendl. This version of Fed feels the same way. But I really hope that I am wrong.
I think that Fed's back is flaring up. His serves are indeed horrendous and his movement has been bad as well.
D
Deleted member 629564
Guest
Yep, you're right. My bad.
I Am Finnish
Bionic Poster
I find the h2h rule stupid
How is it a gift? He still has to win his remaining matches. And if he does, he’ll have 6 titles to Nadal’s 4, and 5 “big” titles to Nadal’s 4. More match wins on the season, more finals, etc. It would be a deserving number one, would it not?
Service Ace
Hall of Fame
Yeah, right. This completely ignores the fact that matchups matter. Fed isn't some random journeyman or next gen mug who gets hot every couple months, he's a former champion with a tragic history and a poor mental matchup going against the only ghost to haunt him more than Nadal. Djokovic/Fed is the ATPs version of Serena/Sharapova, the outcome no longer in doubt.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Their seasons were close. But as always Djokovic takes the advantage of being a better player in the fall season.
Yugram
Legend
.... for a week?
Of course they were close. Nadal can still finish number one here, even if he gets obliterated by Tsitsipas. I’d say he’s in a pretty good position, all things considered.
And knowing how good Djokovic is or can be in the fall, Nadal should have accumulated more points earlier in the year to make up for it. I don’t see why Djokovic being dominant in the fall makes his year any less impressive. There’s no “gifting” involved. Whoever ends up number one will have deserved it by earning it throughout the year, not this one tournament.
TennisFan3
Talk Tennis Guru
I agree. Djokovic is definitely the favorite. But this in an indoor court and Fed's a better indoor player than Djokovic, so Fed definitely has a chance.
However since Fed's not looked great in his matches so far (not anywhere close to his Wimbledon level) - the chances of him winning are less than 50% - maybe between 30 and 40%.
D
Deleted member 766172
Guest
I thought I wouldn't spend money on tennis tv again, but gosh darn it, this match is worth it!
*Looks to find $3.28 left in bank account*
Do I give up some crypto for this match?
*Looks to find $3.28 left in bank account*
Do I give up some crypto for this match?
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Yes, Nadal has only himself to blame. He had a terrible clay season by his standards. Losing Monte Carlo with only Fognini and Lajovic remaining in the draw was horrible. He found exactly "the right time" to show his worst clay tennis in 14 years. If he took these 640 points then his yesterday's win over Medvedev would give him the YE#1. But he messed it up.
Breakpointerer
Legend
Novak won't. Fed might.
D
Deleted member 766172
Guest
The man won 2 GSs. I'd say he had a pretty good year regardless of his ranking. I doubt he's thinking about this too much.
Yugram
Legend
If Federer wins, I put any Federer avatar of @Lleytonstation ’s choice till the end of the month.
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
If Novak wins, I will root for Nadal and Medvedev to win their matches
D
Deleted member 766172
Guest
I am at a crossroads. Federer is my favorite, Djokovic is my 2nd favorite, and I really dislike Nadal (as a player). I think I'm going to root for Federer.
True. On the flip side, if Novak stumbles here, he’ll rue his poor performance in three of his best events: Indian Wells, Miami, and the WTF. They’ve both had some missed opportunities this year.
D
Deleted member 766172
Guest
You can't be cereal right now. You two are literally talking about the two players who split the Grand Slams as having "missed opportunities"?!?!?!
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