Active players more talented than Federer

Federer20042006

Federer20042006

Banned
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
 
FD3S

FD3S

Hall of Fame
derek08844 said:
Of course and that is why Federer ONLY has 17 majors because he is only the 12th most talented guy
Click to expand...

No, man - I think OP's trying to highlight Fed's greatness as, even with the VAST talent deficiency (just look at the list, Christ almighty) he still won seventeen majors!

Imagine the savvy, work ethic, and grit it took for a similarly talentless guy like Roddick to win his single slam, even in his weak era - now multiply all those qualities not once, not twice, but seventeen times over, and you have Roger Federer.

Mental midgets the rest of the tour, really. Take Nadal, for instance. Rafa's got Fed beat in all those categories (H2H included, of course) and he still trails him in majors, weeks at no. 1, and... well, a lot of other things? Goddamn.
 
Last edited:
P

Phalagoo

Rookie
FD3S said:
No, man - I think OP's trying to highlight Fed's greatness as, even with the VAST talent deficiency (just look at the list, Christ almighty) he still won seventeen majors!

Imagine the savvy, work ethic, and grit it took for a similarly talentless guy like Roddick to win his single slam, even in his weak era - now multiply all those qualities not once, not twice, but seventeen times over, and you have Roger Federer.

Mental midgets the rest of the tour, really. Take Nadal, for instance. Rafa's got Fed beat in all those categories (H2H included, of course) and he still trails him in majors, weeks at no. 1, and... well, a lot of other things? Goddamn.
Click to expand...

Wow, Federer must be god. Thanks to the OP or else I probably would have never figured that out.
 
Charlemagne

Charlemagne

Hall of Fame
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...


LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!
 
S

spinovic

Hall of Fame
FD3S said:
No, man - I think OP's trying to highlight Fed's greatness as, even with the VAST talent deficiency (just look at the list, Christ almighty) he still won seventeen majors!

Imagine the savvy, work ethic, and grit it took for a similarly talentless guy like Roddick to win his single slam, even in his weak era - now multiply all those qualities not once, not twice, but seventeen times over, and you have Roger Federer.

Mental midgets the rest of the tour, really. Take Nadal, for instance. Rafa's got Fed beat in all those categories (H2H included, of course) and he still trails him in majors, weeks at no. 1, and... well, a lot of other things? Goddamn.
Click to expand...

I agree. This undoubtedly means he is the most intelligent player. And, not only that, but the greatest fighter with more heart and mental toughness than anyone on tour.
 
Bender

Bender

G.O.A.T.
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...
You're like the reverse Chico.
 
Russeljones

Russeljones

Talk Tennis Guru
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...

All we can conclude from this, or rather reaffirm, is that you don't know anything about tennis. Are you banned from Facebook?
 
N

Nathaniel_Near

Guest
image.php
 
J

jg153040

G.O.A.T.
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...

Well, if that is true, that would make him being ranked nr.2 even more impressive, right?

Also, how can a less talented guy way past his prime still be ranked above all of them, bar Djokovic? What reasons do you give? You said once, he is the smartest out there. But isn't being smart talent?

Which is it?
 
Bender

Bender

G.O.A.T.
jg153040 said:
Well, if that is true, that would make him being ranked nr.2 even more impressive, right?



Also, how can a less talented guy way past his prime still be ranked above all of them, bar Djokovic? What reasons do you give? You said once, he is the smartest out there. But isn't being smart talent?



Which is it?
Click to expand...


Well, being smart is pointless if you don't have the means (ie tools / firepower) to execute.

Physicality presumably plays a big role, because a big part of having the "best forehand" or "best volleys" requires strength and stellar reaction times, respectively (amongst others). Placement or shot selection is pointless if you can't hit that forehand hard enough to wrong-foot an opponent, or your shot selection is between a Gasquet-tier forehand, a Moya-grade backhand, or a Djokovic overhead.

Being tennis-smart per se doesn't make a player talented, although strategy does indeed play a big role. However, how much of this comes down to the brains of the player's coaching team is worth considering as well.

Not that any of this matters in the end; we're trying to employ sense and rationality in a troll thread, which makes us the idiots at the end of the day :lol:
 
Bender

Bender

G.O.A.T.
Mainad said:
My question: Active players more talented in EVERY department than Federer?



My answer: None!
Click to expand...


The very definition of having the GOAT forehand, backhand slice, and serve (arguably) is that there literally can't be anyone better than Federer in all the criteria listed :)
 
J

jg153040

G.O.A.T.
phnx90 said:
Well, being smart is pointless if you don't have the means (ie tools / firepower) to execute.

Physicality presumably plays a big role, because a big part of having the "best forehand" or "best volleys" requires strength and stellar reaction times, respectively (amongst others). Placement or shot selection is pointless if you can't hit that forehand hard enough to wrong-foot an opponent, or your shot selection is between a Gasquet-tier forehand, a Moya-grade backhand, or a Djokovic overhead.

Being tennis-smart per se doesn't make a player talented, although strategy does indeed play a big role. However, how much of this comes down to the brains of the player's coaching team is worth considering as well.

Not that any of this matters in the end; we're trying to employ sense and rationality in a troll thread, which makes us the idiots at the end of the day :lol:
Click to expand...

What does make a player talented anyway? I don't think we can resolve this issue, no matter if OP is trolling or not.
 
T

TennisCJC

Legend
Federer is the most talented player of last 30 years. As far as raw talent, McEnroe is probably the last great player touched by the tennis gods.

Most of the comparisons you listed are inaccurate unless you are comparing 33 year old Federer to players in or approaching their prime. Prime Federer is way more talented.
 
B

Bogdan_TT

Hall of Fame
This only proves that Federer really deserves the GOAT title, since he is still no. 2 at 34yo while competing against all these younger players that are clearly more talented than him.

This is not a troll thread. It's proof :)
 
Dedans Penthouse

Dedans Penthouse

Legend
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Niskikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.
So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...
Federer20042006: Better quit.
 
Krish872007

Krish872007

Talk Tennis Guru
Awful list - you've left out at least 50 talented players. What about Fognini? Janowicz? Andujar? Ferrer? What about me?
 
D

Deleted member 688153

Guest
Federer20042006 said:
Nadal: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return. Even volleys not clear cut enough for McEnroe not to say Nadal is better there, too.

Djokovic: Better forehand, backhand, speed, return.

Murray: Better backhand, speed, return, serve power.

Berdych: Better forehand, backhand, return, serve power.

Tsonga: Better forehand, backhand, serve power. Similar talent at net.

Nishikori: Better forehand consistency, backhand, speed, return.

Cilic: Better forehand power, backhand, similar footwork despite huge size disadvantage, serve power, return.

Wawrinka: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, not far behind net game-wise based on carrying their 2008 Olympic doubles team. Moves about as well.

Dimitrov: Better serve power, forehand, backhand, better touch at net, speed/quickness.

Gulbis: Better serve power, backhand, potential forehand power if he'd go back to the old way he hit it.

Monfils: Better serve power, forehand power, backhand, speed.


So Federer may be around the 12th most talented player on the ATP tour. Not bad, I guess...but not worth the oohs and ahhs.
Click to expand...

All bolded stuff = :lol:
And this is assuming you're talking about 33.5yo decrepit Federer.

Prime Roger >>>>> Everyone else on this list.
 
Federer20042006

Federer20042006

Banned
I have yet to see anyone explain how any of what I've said is wrong.

This doesn't mean Federer wasn't/isn't a great player. He has a smart, accurate serve that is extremely well disguised and hard to read, allowing him to hold serve without too much work. He's also unpredictable with his forehand, keeping players off balance...they don't know if he's going to hit to the open court or right back at them. He has the ability to quickly throw junk at people, such as slices (even if the slice itself isn't effective, it keeps him in the point longer against all the more powerful players).

And yeah, every once in a blue moon he would throw in a trick shot. A tweener or a lob that goes in or a backhand overhead or some wrist flick backhand off a half volley.

For some reason, though, that last paragraph is what people here define as talent. Strangely, online tennis fans think that finesse is talent and power is not.

But I've never heard any tennis analyst rave about how talented Federer is. They rave about how great he is, exaggerate the strength of his forehand (which seems to be partly related to how weak his backhand is, rather than the forehand itself)...but they don't throw around the word, "talent."
 
President

President

Legend
Federer20042006 said:
I have yet to see anyone explain how any of what I've said is wrong.

This doesn't mean Federer wasn't/isn't a great player. He has a smart, accurate serve that is extremely well disguised and hard to read, allowing him to hold serve without too much work. He's also unpredictable with his forehand, keeping players off balance...they don't know if he's going to hit to the open court or right back at them. He has the ability to quickly throw junk at people, such as slices (even if the slice itself isn't effective, it keeps him in the point longer against all the more powerful players).

And yeah, every once in a blue moon he would throw in a trick shot. A tweener or a lob that goes in or a backhand overhead or some wrist flick backhand off a half volley.

For some reason, though, that last paragraph is what people here define as talent. Strangely, online tennis fans think that finesse is talent and power is not.

But I've never heard any tennis analyst rave about how talented Federer is. They rave about how great he is, exaggerate the strength of his forehand (which seems to be partly related to how weak his backhand is, rather than the forehand itself)...but they don't throw around the word, "talent."
Click to expand...


"Roger Federer is the most talented tennis player I have ever seen. He has the capacity to become the greatest in history."-Nick Bollettieri

"He's extraordinarily talented and talk about grace on court; watching him play is something special to see and if he does it tomorrow, he'll know what an accomplishment it was."
-Andre Agassi

"Roger's got too many shots, too much talent in one body. It's hardly fair that one person can do all this—his backhands, his forehands, volleys, serving, his court position. The way he moves around the court, you feel like he's barely touching the ground. That's the sign of a great champion."
-Rod Laver
 
Steve0904

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
Federer20042006 said:
I have yet to see anyone explain how any of what I've said is wrong.

This doesn't mean Federer wasn't/isn't a great player. He has a smart, accurate serve that is extremely well disguised and hard to read, allowing him to hold serve without too much work. He's also unpredictable with his forehand, keeping players off balance...they don't know if he's going to hit to the open court or right back at them. He has the ability to quickly throw junk at people, such as slices (even if the slice itself isn't effective, it keeps him in the point longer against all the more powerful players).

And yeah, every once in a blue moon he would throw in a trick shot. A tweener or a lob that goes in or a backhand overhead or some wrist flick backhand off a half volley.

For some reason, though, that last paragraph is what people here define as talent. Strangely, online tennis fans think that finesse is talent and power is not.

But I've never heard any tennis analyst rave about how talented Federer is. They rave about how great he is, exaggerate the strength of his forehand (which seems to be partly related to how weak his backhand is, rather than the forehand itself)...but they don't throw around the word, "talent."
Click to expand...


President said:
"Roger Federer is the most talented tennis player I have ever seen. He has the capacity to become the greatest in history."-Nick Bollettieri

"He's extraordinarily talented and talk about grace on court; watching him play is something special to see and if he does it tomorrow, he'll know what an accomplishment it was."
-Andre Agassi

"Roger's got too many shots, too much talent in one body. It's hardly fair that one person can do all this—his backhands, his forehands, volleys, serving, his court position. The way he moves around the court, you feel like he's barely touching the ground. That's the sign of a great champion."
-Rod Laver
Click to expand...

Owned! :lol:
 
Bender

Bender

G.O.A.T.
jg153040 said:
What does make a player talented anyway? I don't think we can resolve this issue, no matter if OP is trolling or not.
Click to expand...

I agree that we probably won't be able to settle this issue.

We'll probably continue to use it the same way we have used the term for decades - to describe those players we like.
 
Federer20042006

Federer20042006

Banned
President said:
"Roger Federer is the most talented tennis player I have ever seen. He has the capacity to become the greatest in history."-Nick Bollettieri

"He's extraordinarily talented and talk about grace on court; watching him play is something special to see and if he does it tomorrow, he'll know what an accomplishment it was."
-Andre Agassi

"Roger's got too many shots, too much talent in one body. It's hardly fair that one person can do all this—his backhands, his forehands, volleys, serving, his court position. The way he moves around the court, you feel like he's barely touching the ground. That's the sign of a great champion."
-Rod Laver
Click to expand...

Those aren't analysts. Two former players and a coach.

I'm talking about the McEnroes, Cahills, etc.
 
President

President

Legend
Federer20042006 said:
Those aren't analysts. Two former players and a coach.

I'm talking about the McEnroes, Cahills, etc.
Click to expand...

"It might just mean that Roger may eventually have to take a good chunk of time off the tour to make sure he addresses his problem. He’s an incredible talent and an incredible guy off the court as well. If he can fix it up, I have no doubt that he can put himself in a place to win more majors." - Darren Cahill

"He's the most gifted player that I've ever seen in my life. I've seen a lot of people play. I've seen the (Rod) Lavers, I played against some of the great players—the Samprases, Beckers, Connors, Borgs, you name it. This guy could be the greatest of all time. That, to me, says it all."-John McEnroe
 
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