mike danny
Bionic Poster
I never once implied that. Was just taking it big tournament by big tournament it. Never proclaimed which was better.
Better year 2007 or 2015?
- Thread starter RS
- Start date
NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
2015 Federer without Djokovic wins 2 slams, 3 masters and the YEC which would be better results than 2005 with the YEC win.
Only 1 slam less than 2007 because of the upset at the AO.He was a really strong opponent, probably same level as 2007 Nadal but Nadal a little stronger at RG.
abmk
Bionic Poster
ok, here's something interesting. Djoko clearly more consistent in 2015 than Fed in 2007 considering the whole year, but ...
Fed at AO 07 > Djoko at AO 15
Fed at RG 07 > Djoko at RG 15
Fed at Wim 07 > Djoko at Wim 15
Fed at USO 07 > Djoko at USO 15
and with that a very good night from my end.
Fed at AO 07 > Djoko at AO 15
Fed at RG 07 > Djoko at RG 15
Fed at Wim 07 > Djoko at Wim 15
Fed at USO 07 > Djoko at USO 15
and with that a very good night from my end.
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NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
I think you are a comedian. Where can i see you perform?ok, here's something interesting. Djoko clearly more consistent in 2015 than Fed in 2007 considering the whole year, but ...
Fed at AO 07 > Djoko at AO 15
Fed at RG 07 > Djoko at RG 07
Fed at Wim 07 > Djoko at Wim 15
Fed at USO 07 > Djoko at USO 15
and with that a very good night from my end.
RS
Bionic Poster
How do you prove this ?ok, here's something interesting. Djoko clearly more consistent in 2015 than Fed in 2007 considering the whole year, but ...
Fed at AO 07 > Djoko at AO 15
Fed at RG 07 > Djoko at RG 07
Fed at Wim 07 > Djoko at Wim 15
Fed at USO 07 > Djoko at USO 15
and with that a very good night from my end.
Gives the impression that Djokovic is no where near Federer.
BackhandDTL
Hall of Fame
The thing with Davydenko was that he was playing well in spurts to go up a break and then choked massively. He was very up and down. Gasquet was average the whole match. I’ll give it to Davydenko but it’s close, since he actually looked like he could have sneaked in a set, or even have won the first set.
I do concede about Roddick tho. That was one of the best post 04 Roddicks but he still lost the big points with his mediocre approaching. Tiebreak first set, tiebreak second set, when he was about to lose the break in the 3rd.
He was indeed really muscling the crap out of the ball, maybe I was expecting the forehand to be a bit more penetrating.
But yeah, Roddick over Robredo definitely. Even though honestly I don’t think Roddick fares any better with Nadal in his form against Robredo (perhaps considerably worse), with every ball being tornadoed to his BH and getting passed at will.
So I think it really is a matter of Roddick QF with the big edge in difficulty, Davydenko slight edge and Djokovic USO 2013 with the moderate edge in difficulty. For me it’s about even, with weighing the importance of the slam final.
Druss
Hall of Fame
This is not even a contest. At least between 2006 and 2015 it's debatable either way. 2007 is the dawn of the golden era. Young Djokovic making his statement, 2 peak ATGs (Nadal and Federer), quality top 10 (Nalby, Davy, Ferru, ARod, Gonzo... Muzza coming through). If 2007 is weak, then so is 2008. 2007 Nadal > or = 2008 Fed.
NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
07 vs 15 top 10 ->
Federer < Djokovic
Nadal > Murray
Djokovic < Federer (pre prime vs peak)
Davydenko < Wawrinka
Ferrer < Nadal
Roddick > Berdych
Gonzalez > Ferrer
Gasquet < Nishikori
Nalbandian > Gasquet
Robredo < Tsonga
Close but 2015 has a clearly stronger top 5, with 2007 having a slightly stronger 6-10.
Towny
Hall of Fame
I think 2015 is overall pretty underrated (by some, massively overrated by others) but I would have to say that 2007 having two prime ATGs playing great tennis elevates it above 2015. Nadal at RG in 2007 was a higher level than anyone in 2015, possibly even including Djokovic. His season was considerably better than 2015 Federer's or Murray's too.
2007 Djokovic essentially played the role of 2015 Murray. 1 slam final, 2 SFs and 2 masters wins.
2015 has Wawrinka, who was consistent at the slams and won RG but did nothing outside the slams. 2007 didn't have an equivalent player.
The rest of the Top 10 were better in 2007, especially considering Nalbandian's Madrid + Paris runs
2007 Djokovic essentially played the role of 2015 Murray. 1 slam final, 2 SFs and 2 masters wins.
2015 has Wawrinka, who was consistent at the slams and won RG but did nothing outside the slams. 2007 didn't have an equivalent player.
The rest of the Top 10 were better in 2007, especially considering Nalbandian's Madrid + Paris runs
NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
.
Towny
Hall of Fame
I don't consider Murray an ATG and even if he were, he's clearly not of the same calibre as Nadal and Federer. The 'Federer was peak in 2015' schtick is getting old. He obviously played some great tennis and challenged Djokovic, but he didn't play anywhere near as good as Nadal did in RG 2007. And not as good as Nadal was at Wimbledon 2007 either, for that matter
NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
“I think I'm a better player now than when I was at 24 because I've practised for another 10 years and I've got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “I might not have the confidence I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it's ever been, I volley better than I have in the past.” “I think I've had to adapt to a new generation of players again.”
Federer is a liar?
Yes i agree Nadal RG 07 is better than Federer 15 Wimbledon final, but 15 USO Federer > 07 Wimbledon Nadal so it evens out.
BackhandDTL
Hall of Fame
He also doesn’t analyze tennis to the extent critics do. He doesn’t even know the name of his forehand grip for cripes sake
Towny
Hall of Fame
Federer exaggerates. He's not lying per se. He played outstanding tennis to win Cincinnati (which is when he made that comment). But in the public eye, what is he going to say? 'Yeah, I'm all washed up now and I'm in terminal decline'. What he says in public is not necessarily the same as what he thinks in private. that's true for all the top guys
The Guru
Legend
Even implying that it's close is concerning
DismalFuture
Professional
Oh look, ABCD's alt account.
NoleIsBoat
Hall of Fame
Superb Federer ends Murray hopes
Seven-time champion Roger Federer beats Andy Murray in straight sets to set up a Wimbledon final against Novak Djokovic.
www.bbc.co.uk
"Federer played an incredible match. Sometimes you have to tip your cap in tennis. Roger is one of the best players that has ever lived and that's the best I have ever seen him play." - Tim Henman
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Towny
Hall of Fame
We're talking about competition across the season right? So was Federer peak when he lost to Seppi at the AO? Or when he lost to Monfils and Kyrgios in the clay masters? Was he at his peak when he lost Ramos-Vinolas and Isner in the fall season masters?Superb Federer ends Murray hopes
Seven-time champion Roger Federer beats Andy Murray in straight sets to set up a Wimbledon final against Novak Djokovic.
"Federer played an incredible match. Sometimes you have to tip your cap in tennis. Roger is one of the best players that has ever lived and that's the best I have ever seen him play." - Tim Henman
What's the narrative here? That Federer suddenly became peak for 4 tournaments then went back to being average again?
The Wimbledon SF was a fantastic match from Federer for sure. Henman was right to praise it. Doesn't mean his level was that high across the whole tournament, let alone the whole year
And if you want to see how reliable Federer is as a gauge of his own abilities, take a look about what he said about his own game compared to 2007 in 2013, a complete garbage year for Roger:
"Well first, I hope I'm a better player today than I was back then. I feel like I'm a more complete player today. Although my game hasn't changed much, my experience would allow me fewer mistakes and the ability to deal with challenges a little bit easier. "
Druss
Hall of Fame
I disagree:
I would favour 2007 Fed over 2015 Djoko in AO (arguably Fed’s best) and Wimby, whereas RG and USO it’s 50/50. At the Masters it’s Djoker...so I’ll say overall they‘re on par.
07 Nadal is a no brainer over 15 Muzza.
2007 Djoko = 2015 Fed (Djok at USO/RG and Fed at W, AO par).
Davy & Wawa i agree.
Ferrer > Nadal (like seriously this was Nads worst year since 2003), remember Rafa was losing to every Tom, Dick n Harry.
A-Rod & Berdy agreed.
Gasquet > lol Nishikori
Nalby & Gasquet agreed.
Robredo & Tsonga i agree, except it should be Mussay, in which case it’s 07 Muzza.
Therefore it’s 2007 by a fair bit.
Druss
Hall of Fame
Macca said in 2001 at USO that it’s the best he’d seen Sampras play.Superb Federer ends Murray hopes
Seven-time champion Roger Federer beats Andy Murray in straight sets to set up a Wimbledon final against Novak Djokovic.
"Federer played an incredible match. Sometimes you have to tip your cap in tennis. Roger is one of the best players that has ever lived and that's the best I have ever seen him play." - Tim Henman
abmk
Bionic Poster
How is 2015 Djoko better at the USO than 2007 USO fed?
Fed beat an at his best Lopez, at his best Roddick, Davy and then djoko in the final.
Lopez started out on fire. fed was playing well, but not his very best and Lopez won the 1st set with a break. Then federer raised his level and was unstoppable from then on, finally broke towards the end of the 2nd set after having chances earlier in the set. 3rd set was Lopez's only below par set and fed steamrolled him in that one. final set, Lopez played well, but fed was unstoppable and took the 4th set
QF - the first 2 sets b/w Fed-Roddick were as high quality as it gets. Both going to TBs. Roddick serving monstrously, hitting huge. Federer really sharp, serving well, hitting well, defending well, returning fairly well. 3rd set, Roddick's level only dipped a bit. One so so game and he was broken. Then tried hard to break back, but couldn't. Fed then with an amazing retrurn game to seal the match. The set was closer than 6-2 indicates.
SF - this was an amazing battle from the ground from both. federer was at his best from the ground. but did not serve well in sets 1 and 3. davy really should've taken set 3, but choked there along with fed being clutch. fed's returning also stood out in this match for me. davy also returned very well.
final - Fed was pretty good in the final apart from that one stretch of UEs from 5 all in the 1st set to 1-4 in the 2nd set. (still had to be clutch apart from djokovic choking to take set1).
Djoko did impressive vs Cilic in the semi (albeit an injured Cilic), but no other match where he was at his peak level.
QF, went to a 4th set TB vs Lopez who wasn't playing anywhere near as well as he did vs fed in 2007 USO QF.
2007 USO final fed better than 2015 USO final Djokovic. USO 15 final Djokovic never reached the heights that Fed of USO 07 final did and had to rely on Fed being 4/23 on BPs (about half of them on 2nd serves)
2007 RG fed better than 2015 RG Djokovic as well.
Granted DJokovic of 2015 quarter final significantly better than fed of 2007 QF - beating Nadal impressively (albeit a mediocre Nadal)
But fed of 2007 RG semi > djoko of RG 2015 semi. Granted davy choked and should've won a set, but Murray won 2 sets vs djoko and he didn't play any better than davy did for sure.
fed of 2007 RG final > djoko of RG 2015 final. federer up against a clearly tougher opponent and performed better than djoko did vs stan
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abmk
Bionic Poster
This is my view:
AO 2007 fed > AO 2015 Djoko.
fed demolished roddick in the semi, djoko played a mediocre match vs Stan (his 2nd worst at his prime at the AO after Simon AO 16)
fed played clearly better vs gonzo than djoko did in the final vs Murray (Gonzo and Murray on a similar level, Gonzo a little better IMO)
Wim 2007 fed > Wim 2015 Djoko
Peak fed > peak djoko on grass/at Wimbledon.
Fed fended off a peak Nadal on grass.
Djoko was impressive in the Wim 15 final, but still worse than peak federer.
As far as rest of tournament goes, Djoko had his scare vs Anderson, going down 2 sets to love. Djoko played his best vs Cilic, played as well as he needed to vs Gasquet.
Fed played pretty well in the rest of the tournament incl semi vs Gasquet (apart from one below par set vs Ferrero).
USO and RG I addressed here:
Druss
Hall of Fame
I didn't say 2015 Djoko is better than 2007 Fed at USO. I said it'll be 50/50, same as RG.
Here's the quote: "I would favour 2007 Fed over 2015 Djoko in AO (arguably Fed’s best) and Wimby, whereas RG and USO it’s 50/50. At the Masters it’s Djoker...so I’ll say overall they‘re on par."
Either way it's very close between the two and certainly debatable. When it's that close I'm usually hesitant in picking a clear winner.
RS
Bionic Poster
I wasn’t being real but good breakdown when it comes to Federer as always.
abmk
Bionic Poster
Oh ok, my bad, I didn't pay attention to that
I saw this line
"2007 Djoko = 2015 Fed (Djok at USO/RG and Fed at W, AO par)."
Not sure what you mean by this line then.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
yes Murray really changed the dynamics and Fed suddenly got shortened from winning 3 Slams + WTF to winning Halle and Basel.
Druss
Hall of Fame
I'm pretty much saying that -
2007 Djoko > 2015 Fed at USO and RG.
2015 Fed > 2007 Djoko at Wimby.
2007 and 2015 Fed equal at AO (though on second thought Fed was pretty awful there that year), so possibly give that to 2007 Djoker.
RS
Bionic Poster
Murray + others ?
mike danny
Bionic Poster
RS
Bionic Poster
Nah.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
RS
Bionic Poster
Could expand more years. Did that early last year and Djokovic destroyed the poll.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
RS
Bionic Poster
2004-09 vs 2011-16.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
RS
Bionic Poster
Probably making a thread after I take a break for a few weeks tbh.Well, good luck in your quest of finding that proper comparison.
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mike danny
Bionic Poster
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