Nadal is planning his return to clay at MC

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
im sorry but your the one with the agenda.
its black and white math but you see colors.
his ranking went from a respectable #15 to #136 DURING the clay court season so for you to say he doesn’t depend on clay for his success is just wrong.
It is purely math, and if you knew how it worked then you’d know that roughly only a third of his points lost came from the CC season. I never said he doesn’t rack up a lot of points during the CC season. I said less than half of his points accumulated in 2022 that were then not defended in 2023 came from clay. You’re the one who’s completely ignoring all the points he racked up at the start of the year until 5/21/2022.
 

Rosstour

G.O.A.T.
This whole thing is so dumb. He made a huge deal of coming to IW, then pulled out. He could have literally stayed in the draw and gotten a WO from Miloshhhh, then pulled out...but no, immediately after pulling out of IW he's posting IG stories of clay court prep. I feel like we're being made fools of

Looks like I'm not the only one pointing this out lol. It's such a bad look for him I don't get it.

 

CHillTennis

Hall of Fame
This whole thing is so dumb. He made a huge deal of coming to IW, then pulled out. He could have literally stayed in the draw and gotten a WO from Miloshhhh, then pulled out...but no, immediately after pulling out of IW he's posting IG stories of clay court prep. I feel like we're being made fools of
I agree.

Personally, I think he's a lot closer to being retired, than he's letting on.

You may not see him play any events besides Barcelona, Roland Garros and the Olympics.
 
If, and its a big if unless rafa is teasing us all about his fitness, he wins RG it would be the biggest comeback story of all time and just propel him to a whole new level,of greatness. Im certIn if he wins RG he would retire on that podium as well.
Is he still actually in indian wellsl
 
Many people like you guys were saying the same thing last year and he missed the entire CC season. And a year before that he missed the first month of the CC season. Recent history has outright disproven your narrative :whistle:
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

2023 does not disprove the narrative:
- In 2023 Nadal missed RG for the first time in 18 years
- In 2022, he missed big tournamment on clay for the first time in 15 years

Nadal-Big-tournaments-on-clay.png
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

2023 does not disprove the narrative:
- In 2023 Nadal missed RG for the first time in 18 years
- In 2022, he missed big tournamment on clay for the first time in 15 years

Nadal-Big-tournaments-on-clay.png


Very interesting. It is like you said. The defenders of Nadal were wrong for 2 decades. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. They were right just once when he withdrew from RG. I am not surprised.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

2023 does not disprove the narrative:
- In 2023 Nadal missed RG for the first time in 18 years
- In 2022, he missed big tournamment on clay for the first time in 15 years

Nadal-Big-tournaments-on-clay.png
This is really infuriating how he manages to get healthy for clay each and every year. But doesn't play hard courts.
 

pedro94

Semi-Pro
This is really infuriating how he manages to get healthy for clay each and every year. But doesn't play hard courts.
Very simple if you have half a brain. HCs are harder on the joints and muscles, and with Rafa's mileage it's understandable he gets injured playing on hard. The fact that he rests and recuperates for a month or two after the australian and NA hard court swing then comes back healthy on clay is anything but strange.. it's almost like rest and rehab heals injuries! Who knew!?
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Very simple if you have half a brain. HCs are harder on the joints and muscles, and with Rafa's mileage it's understandable he gets injured playing on hard. The fact that he rests and recuperates for a month or two after the australian and NA hard court swing then comes back healthy on clay is anything but strange.. it's almost like rest and rehab heals injuries! Who knew!?
Then we should ban such players who can only perform so well on clay and can't even play on rest of the year. Its already very late but not too late.
 

pedro94

Semi-Pro
Then we should ban such players who can only perform so well on clay and can't even play on rest of the year. Its already very late but not too late.
Or we should ban such players who are supposed to be role models to millions and go around knowingly spreading disease to innocent people, and who also abuse match officials. Two can play this stupid game ;)
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Or we should ban such players who are supposed to be role models to millions and go around knowingly spreading disease to innocent people, and who also abuse match officials. Two can play this stupid game ;)
Didn't he get banned already? You want him to finish the career or what?

Now time for the KOC to come outside of clay or make decision
 
This is really infuriating how he manages to get healthy for clay each and every year. But doesn't play hard courts.
The problem is not with Nadal but with the fans. A player can decide to skip a tournament for many reasons: because of fatigue, to preserve his body, because of his state of mind, he doesn't fell 100% ready, his personal preferences, etc. Event Federer skipped the European clay court season and the French Open for 3 years in a row.

The problem is with the fans as they like to create narratives to suit their favorite players.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
The problem is not with Nadal but with the fans. A player can decide to skip a tournament for many reasons: because of fatigue, to preserve his body, because of his state of mind, he doesn't fell 100% ready, his personal preferences, etc. Event Federer skipped the European clay court season and the French Open for 3 years in a row.

The problem is with the fans as they like to create narratives to suit their favorite players.
Yes like slam H2H

It's pure bull ****
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Of course it is bc it doesn’t suit you :D
Why would it suit us. Your Nadal just avoided a lot and now he is planning to play Monte Carlo

At some point some honesty is very needed.

Fed won many matches vs Nole in 2014/15 but Nole kept meeting him primarily on fast courts in Wimbledon Shanghai Dubai Cincinnati ATP finals etc. Yes there were some matches in IW, Rome, Mc but fed fans also wanted to hide it under the carpet. While we Nole fans knew what would happen if they meet on Nole's backyard. Then came AO 2016. Even before the match started, we knew the beatdown was coming.

You fans are living very luxurious life where Rafa just up and left and didn't get what he deserved. Now he is coming back in monte Carlo, that's what he says but we will see. Most probably he will play mc because it's clay. And you fans will hide it under the carpet just like last 10 years.
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

2023 does not disprove the narrative:
- In 2023 Nadal missed RG for the first time in 18 years
- In 2022, he missed big tournamment on clay for the first time in 15 years

Nadal-Big-tournaments-on-clay.png
2023 alone doesn’t disprove the narrative but:

2003: Missed Rome and RG = 2 CC events
2004: Missed MC, Barca, Rome, Hamburg, and RG = 5 CC events
2005: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2006: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2010: Missed Barca = 1 CC event
2022: Missed MC and Barca = 2 CC events
2023: Missed MC, Barca, Madrid, Rome, and RG = 5 CC events.

So that’s 17 missed CC events throughout his career (and could be more depending on how this season goes). You guys are the ones who’re using absolute statements like “He’s always healthy for clay.” If that’s the case then he’d have to never miss a single event which we know isn’t the case. No one in the RAFA camp has denied that he’s missed more non-CC events compared to CC events, but when there’s way more non-CC events then common sense will tell you if you were to get injured then you’re statistically more likely to miss a non-clay event since there’s way more opportunities to.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
2023 alone doesn’t disprove the narrative but:

2003: Missed Rome and RG = 2 CC events
2004: Missed MC, Barca, Rome, Hamburg, and RG = 5 CC events
2005: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2006: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2010: Missed Barca = 1 CC event
2022: Missed MC and Barca = 2 CC events
2023: Missed MC, Barca, Madrid, Rome, and RG = 5 CC events.

So that’s 17 missed CC events throughout his career (and could be more depending on how this season goes). You guys are the ones who’re using absolute statements like “He’s always healthy for clay.” If that’s the case then he’d have to never miss a single event which we know isn’t the case. No one in the RAFA camp has denied that he’s missed more non-CC events compared to CC events, but when there’s way more non-CC events then common sense will tell you if you were to get injured then you’re statistically more likely to miss a non-clay event since there’s way more opportunities to.
Barcelona is a 500 series tournament. Why he missed it?

Also do you feel any sense of neutrality when you bring 2003 and 2004 in the discussion? He was 16 in 2003.

Lmao
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
Barcelona is a 500 series tournament. Why he missed it?

Also do you feel any sense of neutrality when you bring 2003 and 2004 in the discussion? He was 16 in 2003.

Lmao
Why he missed it is quite frankly irrelevant. The fact is he missed it, it’s one of the most important tournaments for him, and it’s held in clay.

Who cares what age he was? All that matters is that he was eligible to play those events and he missed them due to injury. He missed CC events in 03 due to an elbow fracture and he missed CC events in 04 due to a stress fracture. Those are injuries so if you guys are going to go around saying he’s always healthy for clay while ignoring the times he’s missed events then it shows you’re pushing an agenda. Absolute statements require absolute evidence to be true. Even if you ignore 03-04 that’s still leaves all the other years I listed. Not to mention during his prime years he missed far fewer non-CC events. Now post-2017 he started missing far more non-CC events, but by then he was already in his early 30’s. It’s only natural to start cutting out events as you age.
 

nolefam_2024

Bionic Poster
Why he missed it is quite frankly irrelevant. The fact is he missed it, it’s one of the most important tournaments for him, and it’s held in clay.

Who cares what age he was? All that matters is that he was eligible to play those events and he missed them due to injury. He missed CC events in 03 due to an elbow fracture and he missed CC events in 04 due to a stress fracture. Those are injuries so if you guys are going to go around saying he’s always healthy for clay while ignoring the times he’s missed events then it shows you’re pushing an agenda. Absolute statements require absolute evidence to be true.
We don't care any bit what he missed before becoming a top player.
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
We don't care any bit what he missed before becoming a top player.
I’m well aware that you guys don’t care when things disprove your agendas lol. For all we know had he gotten to play those events he would have had more practice and experience to break through and win RG a year earlier.
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
Real agenda is 2-1 open now that you can't use 4-3
Again, that’s not an agenda that’s a factual statement. If you guys want to say he’s missed far more non-CC events compared to CC events (even though there’s far more non-CC events thus more opportunities to miss) then ok. But that’s completely different compared to saying he’s always healthy for clay.
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
Why would it suit us. Your Nadal just avoided a lot and now he is planning to play Monte Carlo

At some point some honesty is very needed.

Fed won many matches vs Nole in 2014/15 but Nole kept meeting him primarily on fast courts in Wimbledon Shanghai Dubai Cincinnati ATP finals etc. Yes there were some matches in IW, Rome, Mc but fed fans also wanted to hide it under the carpet. While we Nole fans knew what would happen if they meet on Nole's backyard. Then came AO 2016. Even before the match started, we knew the beatdown was coming.

You fans are living very luxurious life where Rafa just up and left and didn't get what he deserved. Now he is coming back in monte Carlo, that's what he says but we will see. Most probably he will play mc because it's clay. And you fans will hide it under the carpet just like last 10 years.
You know you're excited for Monte Carlo :D
 
2023 alone doesn’t disprove the narrative but:

2003: Missed Rome and RG = 2 CC events
2004: Missed MC, Barca, Rome, Hamburg, and RG = 5 CC events
2005: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2006: Missed Hamburg = 1 CC event
2010: Missed Barca = 1 CC event
2022: Missed MC and Barca = 2 CC events

2023: Missed MC, Barca, Madrid, Rome, and RG = 5 CC events.

So that’s 17 missed CC events throughout his career (and could be more depending on how this season goes). You guys are the ones who’re using absolute statements like “He’s always healthy for clay.” If that’s the case then he’d have to never miss a single event which we know isn’t the case. No one in the RAFA camp has denied that he’s missed more non-CC events compared to CC events, but when there’s way more non-CC events then common sense will tell you if you were to get injured then you’re statistically more likely to miss a non-clay event since there’s way more opportunities to.
It's a theory not a theorem.
Theory is about patterns. It is not about looking for a single event to dismiss patterns.
If it was a theorem then you are right. In theorem you need to have only one example that does not work to dismiss the theorem. But theorem cannot be applied to sport.

2003 and 2004, he has not peaked.
2023, he was way past his prime.
What is the pattern during his prime years? Otherwise you are looking for tail of distribution (rare events) to dismiss a pattern.

ps: 2006 Hamburg and 2010 Barcelone, he did not miss becasue of injury reasons.
 

tennis24x7

Hall of Fame
I'm just hoping he can finish 1 tournament. It will be a shame if he tried to play, but had to pull out. At this point I'm not counting on him to play many tournaments at all. I do want to see him contest for at least 1 CC title this year before he calls it quits.
He will play couple rounds and either lose or pull out. This is all so he can be in peak physical condition for FO. If he wins will retire.
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
It's a theory not a theorem.
Theory is about patterns. It is not about looking for a single event to dismiss patterns.
If it was a theorem then you are right. In theorem you need to have only one example that does not work to dismiss the theorem. But theorem cannot be applied to sport.

2003 and 2004, he has not peaked.
2023, he was way past his prime.
What is the pattern during his prime years? Otherwise you are looking for tail of distribution (rare events) to dismiss a pattern.

ps: 2006 Hamburg and 2010 Barcelone, he did not miss becasue of injury reasons.
Whatever label you want to use is irrelevant. You guys are pushing a narrative that’s he’s always healthy and never missing CC events. I just showed you a list of events proving that statement wrong. Now if you had said he’s missed less events on clay compared to non-CC events then that’s completely different. Then again there are way more non-CC events compared to CC events so there’s more opportunities to miss.

We don’t get to ignore things that disprove our stances. Btw he was already beating some of the best CC players in the world in MS1000 events in 2003. This included 2 RG championships and even the reigning RG champion. For all we know he could have broken through at RG a year earlier had he not had 2 CC seasons derailed with injuries. Especially with how 04 turned out with Coria’s chokefest. And if we are playing the only looking at the events missed in their peak game then he missed far less non-CC events pre-2017. Post-2017 he was in his 30’s when players start to cut back on their schedules anyway. If you get to ignore his pre-prime then it’s only fair that his post-prime gets thrown out too.
 

Clay lover

Legend
I don't even know why Nadal favouring clay even if true is a problem. Federer didn't play clay events for a few years. Novak basically selectively plays and peaks only for slams for the past few years.

But when Nadal is selective, he's suddenly wrong lol. Pros know what thin margins they're working with and will do whatever to conserve energy off inconsequential things and to capitalize on their strengths lol.

How is this surprising or new or blasphemous?
 

The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
i don’t think its a problem but posters like blonde blur do becuz they don’t admit it
Like I said man, there’s a huge difference between saying he’s always healthy for clay vs he’s missed more clay events. The first is an absolute statement the other isn’t. You wouldn’t even acknowledge that he lost more points from not defending his January-March HC points vs his CC season points.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
The problem is not with Nadal but with the fans. A player can decide to skip a tournament for many reasons: because of fatigue, to preserve his body, because of his state of mind, he doesn't fell 100% ready, his personal preferences, etc. Event Federer skipped the European clay court season and the French Open for 3 years in a row.

The problem is with the fans as they like to create narratives to suit their favorite players.
It's Rafa bashers who are constantly generating dumb imaginary stories about him. His injury history has been well documented, but it hasn't stopped his bashers from constantly generating stupid false stories about him. :eek:
 

KantenKlaar

Hall of Fame
The idea to "switch" seems odd to me. I never was a fan of Doctor Cotorro's
patient and *fourteen-time* [so unusual!] FO winner Raffers. Guga, Courier, and Borg
are more my style there: Honest tennis players.
Drop the Raffers. Rafael Nadal. Mr Nadal for you.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
The idea to "switch" seems odd to me. I never was a fan of Doctor Cotorro's
patient and *fourteen-time* [so unusual!] FO winner Raffers. Guga, Courier, and Borg
are more my style there: Honest tennis players.
The posts where you have trash talked Rafa don't show that honesty is your style, Fed devotee.
 

Rosstour

G.O.A.T.
You, Fed devotee, posted a Rafa basher's (aka a Djoko fanatic) tweet. Bashers' trash talk has no importance.

That guy is annoying but it's a good point regardless

It's a really bad look to pull out citing health/injury and then post training videos like two days later. Especially right after playing an exhibition and plenty of golf
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
That guy is annoying but it's a good point regardless
Rafa fans who replied to 'that guy' (the Djoko fanatic) destroyed 'that guy'. (Click on the timestamp of his tweet and scroll down to read the replies.)

It's a really bad look to pull out citing health/injury and then post training videos like two days later. Especially right after playing an exhibition and plenty of golf
Rafa did not cite an injury:

 

big ted

Legend
who cares ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, we’re talking about his ranking from 5/22/23-6/12/23 so those points are erased for EVERYONE by then anyway…
Which you sarcastically said “Who cares?” Easy to say that when you’ve been proven wrong lol.

You’re the one who’s completely ignoring all the points he racked up at the start of the year until 5/21/2022.

what about them?. like you said he lost at united cup and at AO the next year. you’re blaming his drop was from not playing doha & indian wells?!?
 
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