JoelDali
Talk Tennis Guru
Fedr
Serena Williams
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NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Which is not surprising and I knew he would come out in defense of her, as will the majority of the tennis players, ex players, etc. I'm just going to comment and not bother talking about this again since it has become less about talking about Serena's behavior and more about how much can we trash Serena on here and redefine every way that she is a horrible human being. The whole situation was unfortunate and the reaction on here just rubs me the wrong way to be honest.
Like I said yesterday. Carlos Ramos is a pr**k. Djokovic knows it, Del Potro also knows it and he spoke up for her as well, and plenty of other players know it. He should have diffused the situation yesterday and he didn't. Serena should have contained herself and she didn't. It takes two to tango but it was his job to calmly explain to her after the first warning when she started getting upset that it was directed at her coach and not at her. It's same thing Davenport, Annacone and Wertheim said on Tennis Channel and they also said like I did the game penalty was excessive. So yea Serena was embarrassing but he played his part as well. That's pretty much all I'm going to say about that.
JSZ
Rookie
Here is another interesting link from retired umpire Richard Ings. www.smh.com.au/sport/tennis/it-is-serena-williams-who-owes-an-apology-to-umpire-carlos-ramos-20180909-p502q2.html Ings gave John MacEnroe a game penalty at 1987 US Open.
D
Deleted member 716271
Guest
Hey man I agree with you that she should have behaved better. With Ramos I think it was borderline but what you have to remember is it was an accrued penalty, he just gave her another violation. It was her past behavior that led to that. It's not really his job to not give a violation just because of what it would lead to being her 3rd one, if he felt she deserved the violation. In other words, he didnt really decide to dock her a game. It just resulted in that.
Where I think it is less ambiguous is how Serena acted after the match talking about sexism. That is crazy. I also felt she continued to take away from Osaka's win who played great.
I have and always will prefer Venus.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
True but it's his job to use discretion, especially in a GS final. It was his 1st women's GS final at the USO and it turned into a s**t show. I'm just saying he did little to nothing to diffuse the tension and only let it spiral out of control. He also could have used discretion being that it was a big final and not decided to give her that last violation but he did it anyway. All three of them on panel of the Tennis Channel just said you cannot do that at a high profile of a match in that situation when it's so borderline.
And yes Serena behaved terribly and became unhinged. It's like once she gets upset she has no self control and cannot see how terrible she looks. It's really unfortunate that she has never learned from these situations and how to handle them better. She could have handled that much better yesterday and then let it rip in the press conference. Venus would never act like that because Venus is more composed and has more self control, and just less of a diva.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Umpires supporting umpires - it wasn't a terribly interesting take on the issue.
No one disputes that at a technical level Ramos behaved correctly.
The question is whether it could have been handled better with another person in charge.
The further question is whether the rule needs to be changed so that the coach is removed from the player's line of sight.
No one disputes that at a technical level Ramos behaved correctly.
The question is whether it could have been handled better with another person in charge.
The further question is whether the rule needs to be changed so that the coach is removed from the player's line of sight.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Oh she’s a jehovas witness? Quick! Run and hide before she tries to hand you a pamphlet
You sound like you need it more than anyone.
MatsPhilander
Legend
WTA saying Carlos is sexist-what a world we live in where a man cannot do his job for fear of the metoo victim mentality sisterhood. Female & don't want to take any responsibility for your behaviour/actions-just call sexism & male privilege. it seems they will have to recruit a lot more female umpires & just have the men umpiring the men-because no male umpire is going to risk even warning a female player after this.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45468290
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45468290
anhedonia
New User
If a male player would have behaved like Serena did towards a female umpire, I'm pretty sure he would have been defaulted and called a sexist. Think of Fognini.
I'm also shocked at the amount of support Serena is getting. It's like "Serena is a great champion, they shouldn't have pushed her to the limit". That's just ridiculous. People, including other players obviously, don't have b*lls. Male players don't have a choice and have to back up Serena otherwise they'll get burned on the cross straight away. What kind of a world is this? Do people really think it was legitimate to behave the way she did?
Sure, we can have a discussion about the coaching rule as much as you want, but the fact is Carlos Ramos did his job.
Let's be real here. Serena doesn't give a f about women's rights. She just cares about her own interests. She's trying to get away with her behavior by turning it into a political problem. How is that fighting for women's right anyway? Fighting for WTA players who earn millions and are completely disconnected from the reality of most women? Where are women's rights when she threatens a female line judge or when she disrespects other players?
Where is sexism when she gets the privilege to be seeded 25th at Wimbledon?
She's a disgrace to tennis. I'm a woman, and I honestly don't want her to speak on behalf of all women.
I'm also shocked at the amount of support Serena is getting. It's like "Serena is a great champion, they shouldn't have pushed her to the limit". That's just ridiculous. People, including other players obviously, don't have b*lls. Male players don't have a choice and have to back up Serena otherwise they'll get burned on the cross straight away. What kind of a world is this? Do people really think it was legitimate to behave the way she did?
Sure, we can have a discussion about the coaching rule as much as you want, but the fact is Carlos Ramos did his job.
Let's be real here. Serena doesn't give a f about women's rights. She just cares about her own interests. She's trying to get away with her behavior by turning it into a political problem. How is that fighting for women's right anyway? Fighting for WTA players who earn millions and are completely disconnected from the reality of most women? Where are women's rights when she threatens a female line judge or when she disrespects other players?
Where is sexism when she gets the privilege to be seeded 25th at Wimbledon?
She's a disgrace to tennis. I'm a woman, and I honestly don't want her to speak on behalf of all women.
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MatsPhilander
Legend
That is the world we now live in-a post on social media makes a man guilty of whatever he is accused of like Woody Allen for instance. The crying shame is all this drivel that catches on via social media actually detracts from the real problems millions of women are facing worldwide-FGM, human trafficking etc, nah-let's get upset about some guy making a pass at a woman & some pampered multi-millionaire brat getting docked a game in a slam final.
VaporDude95
Banned
I’m not Serena.
MatsPhilander
Legend
If true they can blame Carlos for driving her to do it & bill him for the damage #metoo.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
A journalist may have claimed such but unless he gives his sources, or these sources are official, he cannot CONFIRM anything.
terribleIVAN
Hall of Fame
What a lot of boll**ks.
She's a veteran of the tour, not a junior.
She knows the score.
She was gaming the system because she was losing at home.
You'll never see her throw these tantrums at any other slam abroad.
A despicable human being backed by a spineless WTA association.
.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Like I said earlier, I'm done talking about it. I stated my opinion on it and have no desire to talk about it anymore. I would rather discuss actual tennis than revisit this again.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
You're right, she's not busy bashing people online.
Nagal_fan
Rookie
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...ire-straight-after-coaching-violation-warning (Same thing happened to Venus Williams at RG16, what a contrast in response of 2 sisters. She also said that she was not a cheater but she didn't ****ing demand an apology.)
1. http://www.tennis.com/pro-game/2013...tion-i-didnt-understand-coaching-rules/46554/
2. http://en.espn.co.uk/tennis/sport/story/31805.html (this was wimbledon third round i think.)
3. https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...s-but-you-cant-call-it-cheating-10351517.html (article from 2015 saying 24 coaching violations have been given in past 5 years i think in grand slams.)
4. https://www.**************.org/tenn...-coaching-code-violation-was-ridiculous/(Alex zverev recieved a code violation for coaching in 3rd or 4th round of this year's wimbledon.)
5. https://indianexpress.com/article/s...d-goffin-but-gets-coaching-violation-4939304/ (Dimitrov recieved coaching violation in WTF final last year.)
6. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...-and-angry-ostapenko/articleshow/64923136.cms (another code violation in wimbledon 4th round this year for coaching.)
7. http://www.skysports.com/tennis/new...ion-during-her-third-round-wimbledon-win(code violation in wimbledon 3rd round of 2016)
8. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ues-for-15-year-old-kostyuk-idUSKBN1F60ER(2nd round of Australian open)
Unfortunately, I couldn't find any youtube videos so I only have these articles.
for every one saying coaching violations are never given, they are given but they are not reported as much because its not a big deal.
https://www.si.com/tennis/2017/09/20/mailbag-on-court-coaching-rule-tennis , https://lastwordonsports.com/2015/03/26/crackdown-on-illegal-coaching-in-tennis-needed/
1. http://www.tennis.com/pro-game/2013...tion-i-didnt-understand-coaching-rules/46554/
2. http://en.espn.co.uk/tennis/sport/story/31805.html (this was wimbledon third round i think.)
3. https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...s-but-you-cant-call-it-cheating-10351517.html (article from 2015 saying 24 coaching violations have been given in past 5 years i think in grand slams.)
4. https://www.**************.org/tenn...-coaching-code-violation-was-ridiculous/(Alex zverev recieved a code violation for coaching in 3rd or 4th round of this year's wimbledon.)
5. https://indianexpress.com/article/s...d-goffin-but-gets-coaching-violation-4939304/ (Dimitrov recieved coaching violation in WTF final last year.)
6. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...-and-angry-ostapenko/articleshow/64923136.cms (another code violation in wimbledon 4th round this year for coaching.)
7. http://www.skysports.com/tennis/new...ion-during-her-third-round-wimbledon-win(code violation in wimbledon 3rd round of 2016)
8. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ues-for-15-year-old-kostyuk-idUSKBN1F60ER(2nd round of Australian open)
Unfortunately, I couldn't find any youtube videos so I only have these articles.
for every one saying coaching violations are never given, they are given but they are not reported as much because its not a big deal.
https://www.si.com/tennis/2017/09/20/mailbag-on-court-coaching-rule-tennis , https://lastwordonsports.com/2015/03/26/crackdown-on-illegal-coaching-in-tennis-needed/
True, but what can I say... kids...
Nagal_fan
Rookie
Read my previous post, coaching violations have been given to both men and women in the past including Nadal, Djokovic, Zverev, Dimitrov etc in grand slams too.(*Not in a grand slam final)
terribleIVAN
Hall of Fame
Let's reverse the roles.
Serena, not Osaka, leads by 6-2 .
Ramos gives Serena a coaching warning at 1-0 Serena.
Does Williams smash her racket after losing her break while leading 6-2, 3-2 ?
And after receiving a point penalty, does Serena embark on a hysterical tirade because this second warning?
Of course not.
Because she was in front.
It's only when you think you can't win that you start to look for others means to victory.
And let's remember too Ramos did de-escalate his first warning: " I know that (you didn't mean to cheat)" in an extremely polite way can clearly be heard during the change-over.
How come the medias forgot to mention this?
An honest mistake, surely...
Serena, not Osaka, leads by 6-2 .
Ramos gives Serena a coaching warning at 1-0 Serena.
Does Williams smash her racket after losing her break while leading 6-2, 3-2 ?
And after receiving a point penalty, does Serena embark on a hysterical tirade because this second warning?
Of course not.
Because she was in front.
It's only when you think you can't win that you start to look for others means to victory.
And let's remember too Ramos did de-escalate his first warning: " I know that (you didn't mean to cheat)" in an extremely polite way can clearly be heard during the change-over.
How come the medias forgot to mention this?
An honest mistake, surely...
Tennease
Legend
Lol they're the most annoying thing ever. I was in a public bus and they kept pestering me to go to their church lol. They even asked me where I live, if they can come to my house etc etc. Are they that desperate to have new followers? The way they talked to me was so impolite and intrusive or aggressive... it's like predators looking for new victims. They interrogated me like they're my boss or something lol.Oh she’s a jehovas witness? Quick! Run and hide before she tries to hand you a pamphlet
It was two guys dressed up in what looked like school uniforms with formal tie. When one of the guys saw me, he signaled to the other guy by moving his head from his friend towards me. LOL. It's like two gangsters found a victim to rob.
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MatsPhilander
Legend
No surprise-Venus eventually escaped the demented Richard Williams mindset & turned into a class individual & one who became gracious in defeat, she has been a joy to watch for the last decade or so.
MatsPhilander
Legend
I have noticed they have a lot of young attractive women knocking on doors now, even though they dress like they are in the 1950's you can see they are hoping to recruit men via this tactic.
tennis tom
Legend
FAKE NEWS! You should see what the NY Slimes has to say about Freedonia!
Tennease
Legend
Username_
Hall of Fame
Djoker wouldve given them a big fk you to the crowd if it was him. A deserving one.
Would love to see it happen
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
It's always very funny when people like you accuse Serena of bullying, whereas I can do it with a clear conscience.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
You really do believe in the BS you write, don't you?
I have news for you: the scenario that you call "patently absurd" is a fact.
I have no gripes with Serena, don't mind her created image, have no positive or negative attitude towards her many roles in life, and can still say that she has been on occasion an extremely bad sport.
Whether that "disturbs" is a matter of what you mean by it, but it is noticeable and when it happens it is good to be said, especially since she is one of the faces of the sport.
No she bashes them in real life
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
You may be a partial exception to the rule as you haven't exactly led the current 'conversation', but of those that have it is certainly true.
They have far bigger agendas than mere sport.
They have far bigger agendas than mere sport.
You really do believe in the BS you write, don't you?
I have news for you: the scenario that you call "patently absurd" is a fact.
I have no gripes with Serena, don't mind her created image, have no positive or negative attitude towards her many roles in life, and can still say that she has been on occasion an extremely bad sport.
Whether that "disturbs" is a matter of what you mean by it, but it is noticeable and when it happens it is good to be said, especially since she is one of the faces of the sport.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
How about if they point at the right arguments for their criticism?
Or is It a matter of digging deep to find some dirty laundry and dismiss their opinion on the spot?
Primavera
Rookie
Suspect they had to hire a wet nurse given that neither of his parents look equipped to do the job!
He's been dieting since his early childhood like his worthy parents.
Primavera
Rookie
Are you sure either of them can read? Looking at mama's highly intelligent face I don't think so. Your message will have to be painted
VaporDude95
Banned
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
But bashing Mummy is ok ?
You read what you want to read, I've only had good things to say about Djokovic for months. Not only does he have a daughter, but a restaurant in serbia where he feeds the poor for free. He has nothing but my respect. NEXT?
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
No, she just does it in real life, then plays the victim afterwards
And what do you do wrong in your life? Let's put some cameras on you so we can judge your perfection
Tennis_Hands
Banned
You missed to mention the donkey cheese, so you missed on a lot of good things I feel.
Did you do that on purpose?
MatsPhilander
Legend
The race card is so 2016, the sexist card holds so much more fear in today's climate-you can come back from being called a racist, but if a woman levels a sexist charge at you then you are pretty much toast.
MatsPhilander
Legend
Tennease
Legend
You also said Djokovic losing in RG was a Glorious Day. And you were wishing Djokovic out of US Open. You also said Nadal will slice him up in Arthur Ashe.
NEXT.
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Of course im going to root for Nadal, what does that have to do with me respecting and liking Djokovic, this thread has nothing to do with who we are fans of, but the complete crap some people spew. Please quote the posts (I know which ones you're talking about) and try to convince people they were serious, id love to see it. You have things you need to address, and pointing fingers at other people, who don't even have a problem with someone is a lame way to duck it. I don't agree with Serena's antics at all, but I also know im not perfect and it's not my place to sit here and be a keyboard warrior, neither is it yours.
VaporDude95
Banned
And what do you do wrong in your life? Let's put some cameras on you so we can judge your perfection
I’m actually getting top grades in my accounting degree, working towards getting a grad job at a big 4 firm and then my CPA.
Just got a new gym program and booked a music festival over New Years with my mates.
I’m certainly not having millions of dollars handed to me while I abuse my position and the people around me, then accuse everyone for being sexist when I’m called out. Is that good enough for you?
VaporDude95
Banned
This too shall pass. Soon accusations of being sexist will be just as laughable as playing the race card (if it isn’t already lol)
Tennis_Hands
Banned
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
So you grew up black in the poorest neighbourhood in America? Who are your kidding!
The reality is that you have very privileged circumstances and yet you still have a chip on your shoulder.
The reality is that you have very privileged circumstances and yet you still have a chip on your shoulder.
Russeljones
Talk Tennis Guru
Reads almost like a suicide note.
VaporDude95
Banned
Well, trying to reason with SOME people on this forum sure makes me want to end it lol
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