Tsonga has a higher peak than Federer at the Australian open

[Otacon]

One-peak wonder.

 

[HashDump]

If peak is only based on one or two matches there are multiple players better than Federer

If peak is only based on one or two matches than Soderling had highest peak ever. No one trashed Rafa like he did.

 

[KINGROGER]

Federer couldn't beat Nadal in 2009 despite playing extremely well

How is he going to easily beat 2008 nadal?

He struggled against baby Nadal when he was at his peak in Miami 2005 Dubai 2006
lol

Peak HC Nadal struggled grandpa bad back 2013 Fed at Cincy and needed a lucky net chord to finish the match.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

One immediately comes to mind (especially for a Roger-fan):

No doubt my friend.

Absolutely no doubt at all of this peak rally!

 

[Objective observer]

As well as Federer did when he beat Delpo 6-3 6-0 6-0 or Roddick 6-4 6-0 6-2, but you chose Tsonga's example simply because he beat Nadal, a player Rodja has been struggling against during his entire career, so it could fit your theory of a peak level.
The problem is you used a record/performance against a single player (and not the whole field) which is insufficient to draw any relevant conclusion.

Difference between destroying a mediocre player like Roddick and a great one like Nadal

Federer also destroyed Hewitt in USO 2004 but needed 5 sets to beat grandpa Agassi that same tournament lol

 

[Objective observer]

Peak HC Nadal struggled grandpa bad back 2013 Fed at Cincy and needed a lucky net chord to finish the match.

On Federer's favourite surface
Federer got destroyed on clay
But baby Nadal beat peak Federer even on his favourite surface

 

[KINGROGER]

On Federer's favourite surface
Federer got destroyed on clay
But baby Nadal beat peak Federer even on his favourite surface

Rafa needed a lucky passing shot at 5-3, 5th set tiebreak to beat peak Fed at Rome 2006.

Peak Rafa lost 5-2 off clay vs Peak Fed.

 

[Night Slasher]

Difference between destroying a mediocre player like Roddick and a great one like Nadal

Federer also destroyed Hewitt in USO 2004 but needed 5 sets to beat grandpa Agassi that same tournament lol

Nadal is as great in Australia as Hewitt is at the USO. You're either trolling or competing for the most ridiculous thread by the greatest buffoon in the northern hemisphere. If it's the later, I'll give you 10 stars.

 

[Objective observer]

Nadal is as great in Australia as Hewitt is at the USO.

Lol

Nadal's level of play is a million times higher than anything Hewitt can do

 

[HashDump]

On Federer's favourite surface
Federer got destroyed on clay
But baby Nadal beat peak Federer even on his favourite surface

Wait a minute, you're telling me that Djokovic owned peak Rafa?
Baby Rafa owned peak Fed and Djokovic owned peak Rafa???

 

[Objective observer]

Rafa needed a lucky passing shot at 5-3, 5th set tiebreak to beat peak Fed at Rome 2006.

Peak Rafa lost 5-2 off clay vs Peak Fed.

Lol peak nadal is not 2004-2007
Anyway it was 1-2 outside grass/indoors

 

[Objective observer]

Rafa needed a lucky passing shot at 5-3, 5th set tiebreak to beat peak Fed at Rome 2006.

Peak Rafa lost 5-2 off clay vs Peak Fed.

Plus Federer couldn't even beat Nadal once in 2008-9 despite being prime

 

[Deleted member 757377]

2000s peak ELO ratings:

1) Djokovic
2) Nadal
3) Federer
4) Murray
5) Ferrer
6) Del Potro
7) Hewitt
8) Nishikori
9) Wawrinka
10) Davydenko

hardcourt:

1) Djokovic
2) Federer
3) Nadal
4) Murray
5) Hewitt
6) Del Potro
7) Wawrinka
8) Ferrer
9) Roddick
10) Nishikori

clay:

1) Nadal
2) Djokovic
3) Federer
4) Murray
5) Ferrer
6) Ferrero
7) Thiem
8) Coria
9) Wawrinka
10) Zverev

grass:

1) Federer
2) Djokovic
3) Murray
4) Nadal
5) Roddick
6) Hewitt
7) Cilic
8) Ivanisevic
9) Rafter
10) Raonic

Soderling and Tsonga are nowhere to be seen.

 

[Towny]

Plus Federer couldn't even beat Nadal once in 2008-9 despite being prime

He beat him at Madrid 2009 in straight sets

 

[Jonas78]

2000s peak ELO ratings:.........

...Soderling and Tsonga are nowhere to be seen.

I think Nads saw him In 2009

 

[Deleted member 742196]

I think Nads saw him In 2009

Come to think of it, so did Fred

 

[Deleted member 742196]

I think Nads saw him In 2009

Come to think of it, so did Fred

2009 was a bit weird though.

FO Sodering blows Nadal off court.
USO Delpo blows Fed off court.

Maybe its part of the reason 2009 is my favourite year.

All four slam finals had exquisite drama and tennis.

 

[Deleted member 757377]

I think Nads saw him In 2009

So 1 match is enough for you. Good to know.

 

[sredna42]

Federer can only dream of playing like this, especially against somebody like Nadal

Since a match or two is good enough to define peak, which is why Soderling has a higher clay peak than Murray.

Logically the same applies here
Tsonga has a higher peak than Federer at the AO
If anybody disagrees please explain why

LOL I had the link to this vid in my sig up until yesterday. The ultimate godmode. Caning the ball and attacking the net like a beast.

 

[George Turner]

Tsonga has a higher peak than Federer at the Australian open

 

[Jonas78]

So 1 match is enough for you. Good to know.

Im just messing with you. But i still think it has to go both ways. When you beat Nadal at FO, youre not a nobody, at least not that tournament. Of course Murray has been a lot more consistent.

 

[Xavier G]

Too funny this forum, man.

Federer has 6 Australian Open titles, has a 3-0 h2h lead vs Tsonga at the AO and played two classic AO finals with Nadal!

Shame about Tsonga though not making a winning breakthrough at GS level. He was a very good player for a while and really did play well against Nadal in the AO '08 semi final.

Seriously, we need more than that for trolling purposes, mind you...

 

[Jonas78]

2009 was a bit weird though.

FO Sodering blows Nadal off court.
USO Delpo blows Fed off court.

Maybe its part of the reason 2009 is my favourite year.

All four slam finals had exquisite drama and tennis.

Definetly weird! And a great year! Actually one of the weaker years on HC for Roger, both result wise and statistically. But at the same time winning channel slam! Delpo was tough that USO, blew pretty much everyone off court. At least Roger took him to five

 

[Deleted member 757377]

Most wins over 2003-18 Federer, 2005-18 Nadal or 2007-18 Djokovic in Grand Slams:

Murray 5
Wawrinka 5
Berdych 4
Del Potro 4
Tsonga 4
Cilic 2
Ferrer 2
Nalbandian 2
Safin 2
Soderling 2

 

[tennisaddict]

Objective observer hates Federer. This much is clear .

Another Lew on the horizon ?

 

[Objective observer]

Objective observer hates Federer. This much is clear .

Another Lew on the horizon ?

Hate? You're wrong
I like Federer but I do admit I sometimes enjoy triggering his over sensitive fans

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Hey @Lew what are some of your thoughts on 2012?

I believe it was the only year where each member of the Big 4 nabbed a slam.

What were ELO ratings in 2012 and what if any conclusions might be inferred within that season?

 

[Sport]

Khachanov has the second highest peak of the last 5 months.

32 years old Nadal showed a higher peak than Khachanov at the USO.

 

[Deleted member 757377]

Hey @Lew what are some of your thoughts on 2012?

I believe it was the only year where each member of the Big 4 nabbed a slam.

What were ELO ratings in 2012 and what if any conclusions might be inferred within that season?

As you can see here

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/most-gs-wins-by-year-top10.629649/

among the 2000s, 2012 is the year the best 10 players won most GS matches (161). Here are all the records:

top-2 : 2011 (49 wins)
top-3 : 2011 (70)
top-4 : 2011 (90)
top-5 : 2011 (104)
top-6 : 2011 (117)
top-7 : 2011 (127)
top-8 : 2012/2015 (137)
top-9 : 2012 (149)
top-10 : 2012 (161)

 

[Sport]

2000s peak ELO ratings:

1) Djokovic
2) Nadal
3) Federer
4) Murray
5) Ferrer
6) Del Potro
7) Hewitt
8) Nishikori
9) Wawrinka
10) Davydenko

hardcourt:

1) Djokovic
2) Federer
3) Nadal
4) Murray
5) Hewitt
6) Del Potro
7) Wawrinka
8) Ferrer
9) Roddick
10) Nishikori

clay:

1) Nadal
2) Djokovic
3) Federer
4) Murray
5) Ferrer
6) Ferrero
7) Thiem
8) Coria
9) Wawrinka
10) Zverev

grass:

1) Federer
2) Djokovic
3) Murray
4) Nadal
5) Roddick
6) Hewitt
7) Cilic
8) Ivanisevic
9) Rafter
10) Raonic

Soderling and Tsonga are nowhere to be seen.

Peak ELO is not an indicative of peak level of play. ELO is calculated considering not only Grand Slams, but also Masters 1000 and Masters 500. So a player who only wins 1 GS on HC in a natural year could have a higher peak ELO than a player who actually has won the 2 GS on HC.

Just look at how they list Murray with a higher peak ELO than Nadal on grass.That is because Murray won a lot of Queens (Masters 500) without facing Federer, Nadal or Djokovic. But everybody knows Nadal has a higher peak level of play on grass than Murray. Nadal leads Murray 3-0 at Wimbledon and has reached 5 Wbledon finals, not only 3 like Murray.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

As you can see here

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/most-gs-wins-by-year-top10.629649/

among the 2000s, 2012 is the year the best 10 players won most GS matches (161). Here are all the records:

top-2 : 2011 (49 wins)
top-3 : 2011 (70)
top-4 : 2011 (90)
top-5 : 2011 (104)
top-6 : 2011 (117)
top-7 : 2011 (127)
top-8 : 2012/2015 (137)
top-9 : 2012 (149)
top-10 : 2012 (161)

Might it follow that if we are to infer data about players and patterns and matchups that 2012 can be said to be when all members of the Big 4 were closest within each other to their peaks?

Ergo, 2012 is the year to look for detailed analysis within the rivalries?

 

[Deleted member 757377]

Might it follow that if we are to infer data about players and patterns and matchups that 2012 can be said to be when all members of the Big 4 were closest within each other to their peaks?

Ergo, 2012 is the year to look for detailed analysis within the rivalries?

2011 and 2012.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

2011 and 2012.

It is a good approach, I can see why it makes sense. 2011 if anything, is more competitive than 2012.

 

[tennisaddict]

Hate? You're wrong
I like Federer but I do admit I sometimes enjoy triggering his over sensitive fans

How come the objective observer has only threads which target federer and not other players ?

 

[Deleted member 742196]

How come the objective observer has only threads which target federer and not other players ?

His objectivity has a mind of its own.

 

[Objective observer]

How come the objective observer has only threads which target federer and not other players ?

Federer has the most supporters here so I am more likely to get responses so it makes sense to talk about him the most

 

[chut]

That attempted jump smash by Nadal at 2:05... When you try to play like Sampras but actually can't! Since then, he's been much more conservative on this kind of play, letting the ball bounce most of the time and he has been much more successful.

By the way, bad troll, but always nice to see this video !

 

[MasterZeb]

Only in 4R encounters

And only when Nadal wears a polo

 

[KINGROGER]

Plus Federer couldn't even beat Nadal once in 2008-9 despite being prime

Actually he did, 1-0 win at Madrid. But 5 matches on clay/slow as clay HC and 1 on medium grass... good one. If they met at the USO in those years it would be a rout.

 

[ADuck]

And only when Nadal wears a polo

And only when Nadal is wearing a polo on a Sunday

 

[KINGROGER]

Lol peak nadal is not 2004-2007
Anyway it was 1-2 outside grass/indoors

Peak defence for sure, which is what troubled Fed on slow surfaces. Still, 5-2 outside of clay. Lol at this "outdoors" if they met on a quick outdoor court Fed is clear favourite.

 

[Objective observer]

Actually he did, 1-0 win at Madrid. But 5 matches on clay/slow as clay HC and 1 on medium grass... good one. If they met at the USO in those years it would be a rout.

AO was not slow as clay otherwise Verdasco wouldn't have hit 95 winners

 

[KINGROGER]

AO was not slow as clay otherwise Verdasco wouldn't have hit 95 winners

Slow enough for winners to be retrieved. If that 09 final was played on decoturf I doubt it would have went 5. Fed in 4 most likely.

 

[Objective observer]

Peak defence for sure, which is what troubled Fed on slow surfaces. Still, 5-2 outside of clay. Lol at this "outdoors" if they met on a quick outdoor court Fed is clear favourite.

They did meet Dubai 2006 and Nadal won

 

[Objective observer]

Slow enough for winners to be retrieved. If that 09 final was played on decoturf I doubt it would have went 5. Fed in 4 most likely.

What winners retrieved Verdasco hit 95 lol

How many winners should be there lol

 

[KINGROGER]

They did meet Dubai 2006 and Nadal won

So? Their only big fast court matches Fed destroyed Nadal in 06-07 YEC. Same result at Cincy, USO, Madrid Indoors.

What winners retrieved Verdasco hit 95 lol

How many winners should be there lol

Just go watch the match again lol... 2 insane retrievals in set one with Fed serving at 40-15 a break up which wouldn't be possible on a normal speed HC.

 

[Objective observer]

So? Their only big fast court matches Fed destroyed Nadal in 06-07 YEC. Same result at Cincy, USO, Madrid Indoors.


Just go watch the match again lol... 2 insane retrievals in set one with Fed serving at 40-15 a break up which wouldn't be possible on a normal speed HC.

It's a pretty average speed HC
It was slower in 2012
Plus Nadal is super fast

 

[tennisaddict]

Federer has the most supporters here so I am more likely to get responses so it makes sense to talk about him the most

We Fed fans will respond on threads about any players . Don’t worry about that and feel free to point out holes and achievements of other players as well

 

[Objective observer]

We Fed fans will respond on threads about any players . Don’t worry about that and feel free to point out holes and achievements of other players as well

OK

 

[PimpMyGame]

Couldn't agree more with the OP. Sadly Tsonga's future opportunities for greatness were scuppered by the dark forces of the game, otherwise what a different world we'd be living in.

When Fed realised the threat he had Wilson change all of Tsongas rackets by adding 25g of lead at 12 o'clock. By the time Tsonga smelt a rat, everyone was way ahead in terms of quality and achievements. He approached Head for a deal but that was blocked by Djok and Murray. Technifibre never responded to Tsonga's emails and Yonex thought it was a wind up. Babolat gave him a deal but Nadal has been controlling Tsonga's static weight, swing weight, string gauge and tension from afar. The guy never stood a chance.