Why some posters don't like Nadal?
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Lleytonstation
Talk Tennis Guru
I would say Fandom. Some dislike him cause they are a Fed or Djokovic fan. This can blind some fans at being able to look at situations objectively. Some are Nadal fans who have the same problem and can't see reasons why someone could dislike Nadal.
For me, I like Nadal, but as a Fed fan first, I don't want him winning anymore slams. But I can remove my Fandom blinders... from time to time.
You can't get between a man and his GOAT.
For me, I like Nadal, but as a Fed fan first, I don't want him winning anymore slams. But I can remove my Fandom blinders... from time to time.
You can't get between a man and his GOAT.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
KineticChain
Hall of Fame
heh nothin personnel, kid
ANDYbhGENIUS
Professional
Because he's a bad loser, probably the worst in Tennis history. Always citing injuries when he loses... Nadal is the Worst Loser Of All Time.
Write that down on paper 100 times, else the ghosts of Brown, Darcis, Kyrgios, Rosol and Wawrinka will haunt you until time indefinite.
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Tennis_Hands
Banned
ANDYbhGENIUS
Professional
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Bc his epicness is literally unbelievable and they can't stand it 
I Am Finnish
Bionic Poster
Still a mystery why @vive le beau jeu ! Despise him
mtommer
Hall of Fame
Because I believe he has, and perhaps still is, using PEDs. I would say the same for Djokovic, even more so. Before anyone brings it up, "Why not Roger?" How Roger plays and his great sense of anticipation can explain why he's been as successful as he has. It doesn't mean it rules out doping but one isn't left wondering "how". For example, "how" is Nole able to run down ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball, on what should often be points to the opponent. Superior conditioning? Uh, yeaahhhhh....NO, imo. Their "endurance" reminds me a lot of juicing cyclists.
Zebrev
Hall of Fame
You thing they are doing transfusions before the tournament?
I dont understand the petty hatred that people have for any of these guys.
I have never been a fan of Federer, but how can i say i hate him? For a start I dont know the guy, and secondly by all accounts hes pretty chilled and good to the fans.
Same with Djokovic.
Same with Nadal.
They've all got quirks. But it doesnt make any of them "bad".
Living vicariously through your hero to the point where you get satisfaction from tearing rich, successful pro athletes down from behind a keyboard is just...weird.
I have never been a fan of Federer, but how can i say i hate him? For a start I dont know the guy, and secondly by all accounts hes pretty chilled and good to the fans.
Same with Djokovic.
Same with Nadal.
They've all got quirks. But it doesnt make any of them "bad".
Living vicariously through your hero to the point where you get satisfaction from tearing rich, successful pro athletes down from behind a keyboard is just...weird.
I'
These people probably have been "babied", never fought their way from bottom to top, always been handed things on a plate ...
Have I gone too far? I don't care. I don't like these people anyway.
For me I just love the game of tennis.
Because they are jealous. They can't understand how someone with hard work combined with never say die attitude could beat so called players born with "talent". His humility goads them. His ability to get up when down and out gets under their skin.
These people probably have been "babied", never fought their way from bottom to top, always been handed things on a plate ...
Have I gone too far? I don't care. I don't like these people anyway.
For me I just love the game of tennis.
mtommer
Hall of Fame
It's possible. That said, I'm sure PEDs have come a ways, and perhaps, there are now new designer PEDs or delivery methods not even on the radar yet, much how EPO wasn't officially banned but had been in use for awhile anyway.
Zebrev
Hall of Fame
It's certainly strange that you never hear of any doping scandals in tennis like in other sports.
If you would like to discuss doping, please discuss it where it is appropriate (open a thread about doping, bump old thread(s) etc.). As it is, you are just contaminating this thread.
Bender
G.O.A.T.
He is the biggest Nadal fan, get with the narrative already, Hands!
He once invited me to his a secret basement in his picturesque French cottage farmhouse that was inspiration for the opening sequence for Inglourious Basterds.Still a mystery why @vive le beau jeu ! Despise him
But instead of Jews hiding inside, I instead found that the basement full of Rafa paraphernalia...
- Nike Lunar Ballistecs
- Nike CourtBallistecs
- Nike Cage 3s
- Replicas of La Coupe des Mousquetaires
- a 2:1 statue of Federer's backhand with the Pro Staff 90
- a ball machine with only two settings (80 mph @ 3,200 rpm + 70 mph @ 4,900 rpm)
- every version of the Babolat AeroPro Drive
- Babolat finger tape
- Armani briefs
- a red clay bong
- a banana flavoured vape pen (with mouth protection to prevent choking)
- a recycling bin made of blue clay
- a model Kia made by Tomica
- a Richard Mille RM027 Tourbillion that famously "disappeared" that one time
- a drawer containing printed copies of all his PMs with octobrina on TTW
- an large poster of Tio Toni on the wall that on second glance looks conspicuously like an enlarged print of @weakera 's avatar
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Tennis_Hands
Banned
That is like saying that one is "contaminating" an Ebola virus with a difficult to treat illness.
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junior74
Talk Tennis Guru
OldschoolKIaus
Hall of Fame
I just like his mad poetry slam skills more than his (clay court pusher pick pants for at least 30 seconds between points fake injuries as soon as you start to lose) tennis.
Prove:
Prove:
Mainad
Bionic Poster
I'm convinced all of his quirks began when he was quite young and have remained with him ever since. For instance, I cling to the theory that he once double faulted when serving on an important point because a wedgie was irritating him so that, ever since, he adjusts the back of his shorts before serving.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
I'm convinced all of his quirks began when he was quite young and have remained with him ever since. For instance, I cling to the theory that he once double faulted when serving on an important point because a wedgie was irritating him so that, ever since, he adjusts the back of his shorts before serving.
No.
Nadal in his first couple years on tour barely displayed any of the time wasting and mannerisms. He just understood that he can gain advantage like that and has become important enough that the tennis authorities will let him get away with it. After the introduction of the shot clock he went back to being faster no problem.
Third Serve
Talk Tennis Guru
I don't see people giving Djokovic as much flak even though he wastes just as much time, if not more, than Nadal in preparation for the serve.
Back to the topic, I find it frankly disgusting that some posters here have such a hatred of Nadal that they use every opportunity they can to take a dump on him. You're allowed to dislike him, but you shouldn't be flaunting that hatred around.
Back to the topic, I find it frankly disgusting that some posters here have such a hatred of Nadal that they use every opportunity they can to take a dump on him. You're allowed to dislike him, but you shouldn't be flaunting that hatred around.
Gazelle
G.O.A.T.
That's because all the bad cheating people choose other sports. Tennis is exclusively populated by the honest, angelic, beacon of sincerity type of people.
Sysyphus
Talk Tennis Guru
must admit, did chuckle
Phoenix1983
G.O.A.T.
I like Nadal.
It's Novak Djokovic I can't stand.
It's Novak Djokovic I can't stand.
Purplemonster
Hall of Fame
Federer hardly sweats, out of breath and almost never looks fatigued. Now that has PED’s written all over it. He is just as guilty as the other 2.
BasilashvilitheGOAT
Rookie
For the reason that he is one of the greatest players ever. He's dominated on clay for years and not lost outside of that much either. Same for Federer and Djokovic. It is nice to see someone else win for a change.
Subway Tennis
Legend
No.
Nadal in his first couple years on tour barely displayed any of the time wasting and mannerisms. He just understood that he can gain advantage like that and has become important enough that the tennis authorities will let him get away with it. After the introduction of the shot clock he went back to being faster no problem.
Would you say that when you first saw Nadal you liked his game? I remember you saying you saw great potential in him as an aggressive player, but you didn't like the direction he and Toni went in with his game.
Re: @vive le beau jeu ! - wish we could recruit him to make memes about other players. Even as a Nadal fan I find his remarks and visual posts are often hilarious.
mtommer
Hall of Fame
Quite possibly. However, watching Federer play, his level rises and lowers during matches, and he is so good at anticipating what opponents will do that he is often very close to where he needs to be to play effectively. His anticipation, imo, is the key ingredient that allowed him to succeed the way he has. He doesn't run, not that he hasn't had some great defensive rallies through the years, anywhere near to the same degree that Nadal and Djokovic do. One can and does also get points on Federer that in retrospect should have been won being well hit balls. Just look at how many times Nadal has been able to get to a great defensive get running full out. Hey, great get, kudos. And then another one on the other sideline. Wow! That was a great get, too. Thrilling....but then gets another, then another, and another...to the point I'm always stuck asking, "Uhhhh, why isn't he slowing down?". That's just not what you can say about Federer. You do about Nadal and Djokovic. In fact, it's one of the hallmarks they're known for.
Now, take out doping and I've never minded Nadal's play at all, save for how slow he's played between points in the past. Even that is merely mildly irritating. Djokovic is a different story for me but this is a Nadal thread so I won't get into that.
Mark-Touch
Legend
I don't like Nadal because:
1. His game is ugly.
2. He relies on brute power for the most part rather than finesse.
3. He abuses the rules (cheats) by routinely taking too much time before hitting his serve (ie. gains time to catch his breath).
4. He puts up his hand far too often when receiving serve, not because he isn't ready, but to throw off the rhythm of his opponent's serve.
5. His pre-serve routine is unpleasant to watch.
6. He jumps up and down like a monkey (or used to when he was more youthful).
7. He has excuses for almost every single loss of his.
... I'm just warming up, no?
1. His game is ugly.
2. He relies on brute power for the most part rather than finesse.
3. He abuses the rules (cheats) by routinely taking too much time before hitting his serve (ie. gains time to catch his breath).
4. He puts up his hand far too often when receiving serve, not because he isn't ready, but to throw off the rhythm of his opponent's serve.
5. His pre-serve routine is unpleasant to watch.
6. He jumps up and down like a monkey (or used to when he was more youthful).
7. He has excuses for almost every single loss of his.
... I'm just warming up, no?
Rafa's Pigeon
New User
2008 Wimbledon
2008 Roland Garros
2009 Australian Open
Generally being a thorn in Fed's side his whole career
23 - 15
Just a few of the main ones that I can think of...
2008 Roland Garros
2009 Australian Open
Generally being a thorn in Fed's side his whole career
23 - 15
Just a few of the main ones that I can think of...
Tshooter
G.O.A.T.
Mark-Touch
Legend
Given the highly disproportionate number of Fed fans vs. Nadal fans worldwide, is it any surprise?
crazyups
Professional
On TTW, yes. Worldwide, no.Given the highly disproportionate number of Fed fans vs. Nadal fans worldwide, is it any surprise?
Rosstour
G.O.A.T.
My answers, in no particular order:
*Faking injuries
*Using MTOs to ice his opponents when he's losing
*Abusing the pace of the game: taking too long on his own serve (he is the reason for the serve clock), refusing to play at the server's pace when receiving (e.g. Kyrgios Acapulco)
*Obvious PED use
*Absurd grunting, likely one more piece of gamesmanship
I had tried to respect him because of:
*His accomplishments
*His reflexive attempts to be humble and complimentary of opponents
*His charity/educational work
*His longevity
But the Kyrgios match was the last straw. He embarrassed himself on the court and off it, and revealed himself to be the petty, underhanded person I always suspected he was. Then he fired a ball at Tsitisipas during warmups. And then made psycho faces at his box during the Australian Open final. His persona is all an act.
They aren't all the same though. Fed is the most dignified of the 3, and the least chippy/flinty. He's more accessible, more honest, more diplomatic and handles himself with a lot more composure generally speaking.
Yes there are things to dislike about Fed, but they are far fewer and nit-pickier. Rudeness to the umpire in the DelPo match, OK. Yelling "Shut up" to an opponent's box, OK.
But he won't stoop to the levels Rafa does to win. That crap is undignified, everyone knows it, and we just make excuses for Rafa doing it because he generates so much interest in the game.
Rafa isn't talented? Please. His uncle is a former Spanish soccer player nicknamed "The Beast" because of how astoundingly athletic and imposing he was. Rafa comes from a fabulously wealthy family that already included a legendary international pro athlete. This narrative of him just scrapping by on hard work alone is a myth.
This
Murray said it. I'm not sure which one he was talking about, but he openly referenced it.
Kyrgios put a syringe emoji in an Instagram post trashing Nadal and no one even said anything. It's an open secret.
You're both right.
1. The doping methods are always evolving, and because of the money at stake, they are always one step ahead of the testers
2. Tennis officials are well aware of it. They have no interest in seeing their stars be brought down like Lance Armstrong. I said above it was an open secret re: Nadal and I refuse to believe he is the only one
I'm a huge FedFan but I'd be naive not to suspect him too.
Him being out of breath isn't a reason though. He doesn't get out of breath because he doesn't chase every ball down. He plays fast on his serve, tries to end points quickly, and doesn't get into long, punishing rallies.
Reasons to suspect Fed are the fact that he came back from looking absolutely done in 2016 and just cut through the entire ATP tour in 2017.
Sudden, prolonged absences from the sport are always a red flag. That was initially what led me to suspect Rafa. You have to take time off to get clean, so you make up an injury.
I always thought that Fed would be tempted to use them (if he hadn't already) as his career wore on and he found himself skilled enough to beat anyone but not fit/strong enough to keep winning Slams. 2014, 2015, 2016...take your pick as to when he might have reached his breaking point.
Another red flag to me is that he has had two sets of twins. One set of girls and one set of boys. The odds of that are..."infinitesimal" is putting it mildly...unless you are doing IVF. IVF is notorious for producing twins and in this case it is almost obvious that IVF was done, likely both times. Why?
You don't have to make such a huge leap to imagine that they froze his sperm a long time ago in case (or assuming) that he might affect his fertility with the demands of his professional life...up to and including taking PEDs which are notorious for causing fertility problems.
I love the guy and he is my favorite athlete of all time and it isn't even close.
But I'm also a realist, and I fully accept the possibility that doping has been a part of top-tier tennis for decades.
*Faking injuries
*Using MTOs to ice his opponents when he's losing
*Abusing the pace of the game: taking too long on his own serve (he is the reason for the serve clock), refusing to play at the server's pace when receiving (e.g. Kyrgios Acapulco)
*Obvious PED use
*Absurd grunting, likely one more piece of gamesmanship
I had tried to respect him because of:
*His accomplishments
*His reflexive attempts to be humble and complimentary of opponents
*His charity/educational work
*His longevity
But the Kyrgios match was the last straw. He embarrassed himself on the court and off it, and revealed himself to be the petty, underhanded person I always suspected he was. Then he fired a ball at Tsitisipas during warmups. And then made psycho faces at his box during the Australian Open final. His persona is all an act.
They aren't all the same though. Fed is the most dignified of the 3, and the least chippy/flinty. He's more accessible, more honest, more diplomatic and handles himself with a lot more composure generally speaking.
Yes there are things to dislike about Fed, but they are far fewer and nit-pickier. Rudeness to the umpire in the DelPo match, OK. Yelling "Shut up" to an opponent's box, OK.
But he won't stoop to the levels Rafa does to win. That crap is undignified, everyone knows it, and we just make excuses for Rafa doing it because he generates so much interest in the game.
Rafa isn't talented? Please. His uncle is a former Spanish soccer player nicknamed "The Beast" because of how astoundingly athletic and imposing he was. Rafa comes from a fabulously wealthy family that already included a legendary international pro athlete. This narrative of him just scrapping by on hard work alone is a myth.
This
Murray said it. I'm not sure which one he was talking about, but he openly referenced it.
Kyrgios put a syringe emoji in an Instagram post trashing Nadal and no one even said anything. It's an open secret.
You're both right.
1. The doping methods are always evolving, and because of the money at stake, they are always one step ahead of the testers
2. Tennis officials are well aware of it. They have no interest in seeing their stars be brought down like Lance Armstrong. I said above it was an open secret re: Nadal and I refuse to believe he is the only one
I'm a huge FedFan but I'd be naive not to suspect him too.
Him being out of breath isn't a reason though. He doesn't get out of breath because he doesn't chase every ball down. He plays fast on his serve, tries to end points quickly, and doesn't get into long, punishing rallies.
Reasons to suspect Fed are the fact that he came back from looking absolutely done in 2016 and just cut through the entire ATP tour in 2017.
Sudden, prolonged absences from the sport are always a red flag. That was initially what led me to suspect Rafa. You have to take time off to get clean, so you make up an injury.
I always thought that Fed would be tempted to use them (if he hadn't already) as his career wore on and he found himself skilled enough to beat anyone but not fit/strong enough to keep winning Slams. 2014, 2015, 2016...take your pick as to when he might have reached his breaking point.
Another red flag to me is that he has had two sets of twins. One set of girls and one set of boys. The odds of that are..."infinitesimal" is putting it mildly...unless you are doing IVF. IVF is notorious for producing twins and in this case it is almost obvious that IVF was done, likely both times. Why?
You don't have to make such a huge leap to imagine that they froze his sperm a long time ago in case (or assuming) that he might affect his fertility with the demands of his professional life...up to and including taking PEDs which are notorious for causing fertility problems.
I love the guy and he is my favorite athlete of all time and it isn't even close.
But I'm also a realist, and I fully accept the possibility that doping has been a part of top-tier tennis for decades.
Mark-Touch
Legend
OK I'll bite.
Why do you think the ratio of Fed fans to Nadal fans would/should be any different on this particular forum?
Why would it be special?
crazyups
Professional
Not sure, but maybe because there are more older fans on this forum percentage wise compared to worldwide.
er4claw
Rookie
Given the highly disproportionate number of Fed fans vs. Nadal fans worldwide, is it any surprise?
I dont know is that true? Spain seems like a better base for fandom then switzerland. Talking to irl people into tennis here in the US, I dont detect the overwhelming pro fed bias that I see here.
As to your question to the thay other guy. I think older is a good way to put it. Well established is another way I'd describe it. A lot lf people here seem to be 40 to 50 year olds with good careers who play tennis as a competitive hobby.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
You are too kind to respond to that kind of tripe. If there was a player that ever was on the insane level the big three demonstrated throughout the years who displayed normal patterns as far as physical preparation is concerned, it is Federer.
He actually gets less clutch at the tail ends of long five set matches, doesn't come back from back to back monstrous matches like it is nothing, runs less, grinds less, has normal patterns around injury problems with erratic form and lower level, doesn't have sudden jumps in form, going ballistic with it at a flip of a switch, doesn't rely on extremely unusual explanations for his jump of form etc etc.
