I may have overstepped

nolefam_2024

Talk Tennis Guru
For many posts recently we tennis fans have observed current generation outside of Alcaraz and Sinner and how Andy Murray compares to the rest of them. I think I have overstepped in analyzing Andy Murray's greatness.

Murray is not same as Medvedev from today's generation. He is 1 league above Medvedev. I think two of the best of that generation combined in Medvedev + Thiem honestly fairly match what Murray has done on the court but that's two players combined vs one. I still think Medvedev is much better than Andy Roddick as Roddick himself would agree.

But Andy Murray, despite his shortcomings vs the big 3, he has been an absolute legend of this game.

The backhand Murray hits taking the ball early and stepping inside the court, on hard courts it is probably a bigger offensive shot than Djokovic's. The return of serve was at such a high level that best servers will feel smothered. The first serve, while not as good as Roger or even Novak in variety, was vicious and the slice down the T was one of his best serves, completely without a response.

While Murray's shortcomings on second serve and also on the forehands are greatly documented, they were never at unacceptable level like we see in today's players outside of Sinner and Alcaraz. With Lendl in his corner and at peak health, Murray was just 1 step below the big 3 at their best. And that is impossible for all the players today except Sinner and Alcaraz.

So I would like to take a step back and apologize for all the members here for underrating this legend of the game.

 

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
Medvedev is in the same league as Roddick. His time at no 1, ATP finals win and extra slam final put him slightly ahead, but they are of the same caliber - great, consistent, but limited players. Medvedev’s extra achievements basically boil down to facing much weaker competition. He didn’t have to deal with peak Federer.
 

Neptune

Hall of Fame
Murray holds a winning record of 6-4 against Federer in the 2000s, and his performance is on par with Federer and Nadal during Djokovic's initial 6-year peak from 2011 to 2016.

What does this say about Murray's skill level?
 

Poisoned Slice

Bionic Poster
Right on, playa.

tumblr_ml29ajZK4X1qkwizdo3_r1_250.gifv
 

Phenomenal

Professional
For many posts recently we tennis fans have observed current generation outside of Alcaraz and Sinner and how Andy Murray compares to the rest of them. I think I have overstepped in analyzing Andy Murray's greatness.

Murray is not same as Medvedev from today's generation. He is 1 league above Medvedev. I think two of the best of that generation combined in Medvedev + Thiem honestly fairly match what Murray has done on the court but that's two players combined vs one. I still think Medvedev is much better than Andy Roddick as Roddick himself would agree.

But Andy Murray, despite his shortcomings vs the big 3, he has been an absolute legend of this game.

The backhand Murray hits taking the ball early and stepping inside the court, on hard courts it is probably a bigger offensive shot than Djokovic's. The return of serve was at such a high level that best servers will feel smothered. The first serve, while not as good as Roger or even Novak in variety, was vicious and the slice down the T was one of his best serves, completely without a response.

While Murray's shortcomings on second serve and also on the forehands are greatly documented, they were never at unacceptable level like we see in today's players outside of Sinner and Alcaraz. With Lendl in his corner and at peak health, Murray was just 1 step below the big 3 at their best. And that is impossible for all the players today except Sinner and Alcaraz.

So I would like to take a step back and apologize for all the members here for underrating this legend of the game.

Good post and Sorry i may interfere, i know it's not the point of thread but i think Murray is below 1.5 or 2 step than Big3's best.
 

BauerAlmeida

Hall of Fame
Murray is 3 levels above Roddick and Med.

That's a bit much. In terms of consistency, yes.

But Roddick at his best won the summer slam which not even Federer and Djokovic managed. And Medvedev reaches finals on HC slams with extreme ease, despite his shortcomings on natural surfaces.

Murray is clearly the best of the three, but not "3 levels".
 

NaDjoFed

Rookie
of course, It was a Big3+1 (Murray). He was quite unliky to play against three of the greatest tennis players of all time all at the same time
 
Murray holds a winning record of 6-4 against Federer in the 2000s, and his performance is on par with Federer and Nadal during Djokovic's initial 6-year peak from 2011 to 2016.

What does this say about Murray's skill level?

Murray would have zero kudos amongst Djo fans had Federer been on the end of those slam final losses rather than Djokovic.
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
For many posts recently we tennis fans have observed current generation outside of Alcaraz and Sinner and how Andy Murray compares to the rest of them. I think I have overstepped in analyzing Andy Murray's greatness...So I would like to take a step back and apologize for all the members here for underrating this legend of the game.
There is no need to apologize — only my favorite sourpuss Raul S.J. owes an apology, however, please feel free to share specific examples of how AM and/or MHM has inspired you.

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/how-andy-murray-aka-mhm-inspires-you.765098/
 

nolefam_2024

Talk Tennis Guru
Murray holds a winning record of 6-4 against Federer in the 2000s, and his performance is on par with Federer and Nadal during Djokovic's initial 6-year peak from 2011 to 2016.

What does this say about Murray's skill level?
That without injuries he might have been at atg level already.
 

Apun94

Hall of Fame
For many posts recently we tennis fans have observed current generation outside of Alcaraz and Sinner and how Andy Murray compares to the rest of them. I think I have overstepped in analyzing Andy Murray's greatness.

Murray is not same as Medvedev from today's generation. He is 1 league above Medvedev. I think two of the best of that generation combined in Medvedev + Thiem honestly fairly match what Murray has done on the court but that's two players combined vs one. I still think Medvedev is much better than Andy Roddick as Roddick himself would agree.

But Andy Murray, despite his shortcomings vs the big 3, he has been an absolute legend of this game.

The backhand Murray hits taking the ball early and stepping inside the court, on hard courts it is probably a bigger offensive shot than Djokovic's. The return of serve was at such a high level that best servers will feel smothered. The first serve, while not as good as Roger or even Novak in variety, was vicious and the slice down the T was one of his best serves, completely without a response.

While Murray's shortcomings on second serve and also on the forehands are greatly documented, they were never at unacceptable level like we see in today's players outside of Sinner and Alcaraz. With Lendl in his corner and at peak health, Murray was just 1 step below the big 3 at their best. And that is impossible for all the players today except Sinner and Alcaraz.

So I would like to take a step back and apologize for all the members here for underrating this legend of the game.

Slowly you are gaining more knowledge about the history of the game and realising some truths about the great players of the past. Your brain is finally evolving brother, good job
 

Apun94

Hall of Fame
Medvedev is in the same league as Roddick. His time at no 1, ATP finals win and extra slam final put him slightly ahead, but they are of the same caliber - great, consistent, but limited players. Medvedev’s extra achievements basically boil down to facing much weaker competition. He didn’t have to deal with peak Federer.
If medvedev and roddick have similar careers but roddick faced more difficult competition, doesnt that make Roddick better?
 

Apun94

Hall of Fame
That's a bit much. In terms of consistency, yes.

But Roddick at his best won the summer slam which not even Federer and Djokovic managed. And Medvedev reaches finals on HC slams with extreme ease, despite his shortcomings on natural surfaces.

Murray is clearly the best of the three, but not "3 levels".
Young Murray wouldve reached HC finals (and maybe won 1-2) with similar ease if he was facing today's zverevs and rublevs constantly in the quarters and semis
 

messiahrobins

Hall of Fame
If Murray had not suffered the hip injury in 2017 he would have dominated the tour 2017-2023. He got the YE1 in 2016 and was all set it looked like to dominate. Must be so frustrating for him.
Will always be the Big 4 for me as Murray at his best was on a par with the Big 3.
 

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
If medvedev and roddick have similar careers but roddick faced more difficult competition, doesnt that make Roddick better?

He might be, but he’ll never get credit for it. We can’t award hypothetical titles for what he might have done with easier competition. I have Medvedev ahead slightly because he won more big titles and has that extra slam final. I do think the Roddick serve is a bigger weapon than anything Medvedev has in his arsenal by a margin and he definitely dealt with Djokovic better than Medvedev. He likely would have done well in this era.
 

nolefam_2024

Talk Tennis Guru
Slowly you are gaining more knowledge about the history of the game and realising some truths about the great players of the past. Your brain is finally evolving brother, good job
What is history of the game. I have followed tennis from 2012 including many of Murray's peak runs.
 

FD3S

Hall of Fame
Medvedev is in the same league as Roddick. His time at no 1, ATP finals win and extra slam final put him slightly ahead, but they are of the same caliber - great, consistent, but limited players. Medvedev’s extra achievements basically boil down to facing much weaker competition. He didn’t have to deal with peak Federer.
While a lot of people look at the record Roddick has against Fed and jump right to the major final losses, it's worth noting that Federer was stopping him deep everywhere. Out of the twenty-four matches they played, twenty-one took place in the QF stage or later - and out of those three, two were played at the Tour Finals which didn't have a traditional format (both round robin encounters, for the record). Virtually every time Roddick lost to Federer, it meant that he'd made a solid run.
 

fedfan24

Hall of Fame
His hip injury came at the worst time.

He tears it up in 2016, just when Djokovic is about to enter a slump. Could have spoiled the party of Fedal winning 6 straight Slams in 2017-18 and maybe challenged Djoko at W/US2018
He could’ve tired fed out if he made that AO QF or 4R whenever it was, whi ch may have affected the final outcome, but he doesn’t come close to taking that slam, or W. USO he might have a shot if he brings a decent level.
 
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