alexio
G.O.A.T.
saw too he showed signals to her with his hands
2018 USO Womens Final : ThisMama Serena Williams vs Japanese Queen Naomi Osaka
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Calling her a 'creature' certainly tells us something about you.
Mr.Lob
G.O.A.T.
Patrick said he coaches from the stands like 100% of the coaches do 100% of the time. So, not sure where this , "I don't cheat" stuff is coming from.
Fxanimator1
Hall of Fame
Wrong, you’re assuming Osaka was not going to hold her serve, she was already up a break.
Patrick can make gestures all day. If Serena isn't looking at him and doesn't have specified predetermined hand signals that doesnt make Serena a cheater.
It just makes Patrick human.
So the 4 grand slam champions this year have been Wozniacki, Halep, Kerber and Osaka. I'm pretty neutral towards those first 3 players, but I was very happy to see Wozniacki and Halep finally crossing the finishing line and winning their first majors (this year's women's AO tournament was incredible), and for Kerber to win another major at a 3rd different venue no less to show that 2016 wasn't a flash in the pan.
And I've become an Osaka fan since I saw her play Venus at Wimbledon and beat Kerber at the US Open last year, so I'm delighted with her success. She my favourite WTA player alongside Caroline Garcia. She was cool and calm under pressure, served very well and expertly transitioned between attack and defence from the baseline. She beat the in-form Sabalenka in the 4th round before her convincing victories over Keys and Serena in the semis and final; an impressive way to win a first grand slam title.
And I've become an Osaka fan since I saw her play Venus at Wimbledon and beat Kerber at the US Open last year, so I'm delighted with her success. She my favourite WTA player alongside Caroline Garcia. She was cool and calm under pressure, served very well and expertly transitioned between attack and defence from the baseline. She beat the in-form Sabalenka in the 4th round before her convincing victories over Keys and Serena in the semis and final; an impressive way to win a first grand slam title.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
If people were determined to coach, they'd instruct an accomplice next to them to issue coded signals.
He engaged in 'irrational exuberance', without doubt, but there should be a better way of managing this situation other than an accusation of cheating.
Why isn't the first code violation, in any event, directed at the coach?
A violation that would result in a hearing and punishment after the match and would presumably stop him or her from further coaching in the match.
He engaged in 'irrational exuberance', without doubt, but there should be a better way of managing this situation other than an accusation of cheating.
Why isn't the first code violation, in any event, directed at the coach?
A violation that would result in a hearing and punishment after the match and would presumably stop him or her from further coaching in the match.
Raul_SJ
G.O.A.T.
No. Osaka was preparing to serve 4-3 before that game penalty, which then made it 5-3.
Without that penalty, Osaka still likely holds her serve to go up 5-3 and likely wins the second set.
Note also Serena is 2-9 when losing first set of a slam.
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PDJ
G.O.A.T.
She may not have needed her tennis Coach, but she could have used some anger management.
PDJ
G.O.A.T.
How can people watch the Award Ceremony and not be mortified?
A "role model"??? For whom?
The crowd wouldn't be out of place at the Colloseum with Serena fiddling as Rome burns.
And poor Osaka. Just disgraceful for HER moment to become about Serena...
Still, David beat Goliath...
Upside, Chris Evert gets first row seat on seeing her joint record of 6 US crowns not bettered.
Every cloud....
JadeC
Hall of Fame
Just watched the replay. Oh, boy. All the craziness aside, Naomi played well and kept her composure through all that was happening. Completely outplayed Serena. I'm so proud of her.
The crowd booing is seriously just disrespectful. Good on Serena for ending that. The focus should be on Naomi's win. Congratulations to Naomi!
I think it's cute that she was so confused when they handed her the trophy, haha. She didn't know what to do. Then later, she was going to carry her own bag out, until the guy came over and told her to carry her trophy and he'll carry her bag. Such a newbie, ha. She'll get used to it soon enough though. I see more slams in her future.
The crowd booing is seriously just disrespectful. Good on Serena for ending that. The focus should be on Naomi's win. Congratulations to Naomi!
I think it's cute that she was so confused when they handed her the trophy, haha. She didn't know what to do. Then later, she was going to carry her own bag out, until the guy came over and told her to carry her trophy and he'll carry her bag. Such a newbie, ha. She'll get used to it soon enough though. I see more slams in her future.
I agree
Serena was taken a returngame in penalty, not a servicegame. Thats a huge difference depending on how the match had looked so far. Serena would not likely have brooken back. I think the penalty didnt effect the match outcome.
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tennistiger
Professional
Sevastova discusses after every Point with her husband.
Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil
Talk Tennis Guru
If they were to do that, they would create a precedent and going forwards players would be demanding overturn of rulings to no end.
That is why referee's never change their rulings, with the exception being the replay video for line calls.
"Did you guys catch at the trophy ceremony that Serena realized how dejected Naoimi was and decided, oh crap, I might be the bad guy here, better do damage control!"
Yep. She decided to be the good person then and there, AND make the referee the bad guy, who was only doing his job.
Well, she doesn't have to get on-court coaching, she's getting it from the stands.
PDJ
G.O.A.T.
No! I'm loving it!!!
Mean, I know, but all publicity is good publicity as far as Serena Reality Show Williams is concerned.
Ok, one more... I find it quite hilarious when the ESPN commentators (Ugggg) comment that Serena figures things out on her own (so no coaching) when she's behind on the score.
Well, it's a very simple recipe; she's makes less mistakes and pounds her way through the opponent, with a few visits at net here and there.
Not too much mystery in that.
Well, it's a very simple recipe; she's makes less mistakes and pounds her way through the opponent, with a few visits at net here and there.
Not too much mystery in that.
Rogfan
Professional
The match, moment and the day should be about Naomi Osaka. I watched the entire press con and she’s more than adorable! A super cool little girl who knows how to handle pressure and expectations already. Not to mention her tennis! I’m not following her but I watched quite a bit of her matches at Hopman Cup because she was in the same group as the Swiss team. Thought she has huge talent and didn’t anticipate she’d win a slam this year. Well done Naomi!
Enceladus
Legend
Even as a tennis player, Graf is better. Own CYGS.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Oh yeah. Did you get the part yesterday during her meltdown, when she was stating that here she was fighting for women's rights and pregnant women and that they were doing this to her because she was a woman???
Uhhhhhhh, that is so bad. Of course, she failed to mention that she was playing another WOMAN. And the last we heard Naomi isn't Transgendered.
And in concluding, Your Honor, what in the world does fighting for women's rights have to do with a women's tennis match??
I rest my case. LOL
Dude, that's kind of harsh. We're all trying to keep it light, here. It is after all JUST A TENNIS TOURNAMENT. No one died. ;-)
Bah, just ignore it. For sure there's a lot of people out there using "bad" words... but they are just that, only words.
I'm personally coming back from terminal cancer (and winning) so this stuff is small peanuts, theatre popcorn stuff. Like a spec of dust.
a10best
Hall of Fame
She then lied about not seeing him. She then said she did see him give a thumbs up. Everyone saw on the reply that Morataglou gave her a nod after his hand gesture to bring Naomi in to the net. She saw him as clear as day because what happened a point or two later was she brought Naomi in.
Other people here are interpreting his gestures as "hit down the middle" so I wouldn't say it's "clear as day" re: what he was saying and what she was taking him to be saying.
For that matter, I didn't at all think he was telling her to "bring Naomi to the net." I thought he was telling her to approach the net herself.
WYK
Hall of Fame
That's exactly what it's supposed to look like when a coach signals.
https://wwos.nine.com.au/tennis/ser...-us-open/f0a3e048-9017-489d-b8e0-e3e446b6cb23
Nadalgaenger
G.O.A.T.
But she is a MOM!
I'm not sure if it matters HOW the coaching is interpreted? Coaching is coaching, right.
It matters in the context of his argument. He's saying "of course she saw and understood because she implemented his strategy." Whether or not she saw and implemented depends on the content of the coaching, no?
I saw him as saying "come to the net," which she did not do, and which to me is further proof that she didn't register what he was doing (which then sent her into rage after getting warned).
a10best
Hall of Fame
Either way, she did see him and coming to the net played a role in the next point or two was obvious. Her coach and Chris admitted it too. But why care so much about one call or violation? A 23-time slam winner doesn't need to focus on that for the next 5-6 games.
She saw him making gestures with his hands but it's debatable to say the least whether she understood what he was trying to tell her. Even you and I can't agree on what he was telling her; there's a pretty big difference between "make her come to the net" and "go to the net." Not the same at all.
Serena lost to Naomi in Miami too but I didn't see her call the coach for an on-court convo even tho it's permitted under the rules and I think it's pretty clear she prides herself on figuring things out in the middle of the match on her own. That's partially why it stung so much to get the violation.
As to focusing unduly, of course she shouldn't have focused on it. That's not debatable at all imo.
NaomiKonjuhPotapova
G.O.A.T.
What is it with you guys so annoyed with Serena branding herself as a mom?
MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Rickenbacker4003
Hall of Fame
But she DOES look at him and even if she doesn’t want to accept his signals, adjustments are always made in a match, especially if you’re losing. Whether or not it was a direct result of the signals is irrelevant.
Rickenbacker4003
Hall of Fame
Because she acts like she’s the only mom, only sporting mom in the world and we should give her special treatment for that. “Look at me, I’m a mom and I play tennis.”. She’s a millionaire and surely has like paid off 10 nannies to watch and handle her child. I have two kids so I know about what it takes to raise a child. But Kim Clijsters has a baby and then came back to win a major or two. She wasn’t making over the top commercials about it. ESPN wasn’t milking the story about Kim like they did with SW.
If you want to selectively cherry pick what Patrick M said to justify the penalty, then others can use his full quote to say why Ramos was trying to search for something that he could have left alone. A ref's job is to manage a game in a way where folks don't even notice he/she is there.
The 3rd penalty which was the most costly in terms of losing a whole game in a tightly contested 2nd set was totally unnecessary. You've had other players come out and say how they've been given a soft warning for much worse. Yep..it's not his fault that Serena was behaving like a hysterical baby just because Naomi was matching her punch for punch. It was his fault that instead of just ignoring that he decided to get all sensitive about being called a thief and without any further warning docked a crucial game. A noted ref like him should know better.
Also, as I mentioned, if the argument is that players should never argue with refs, then make the rules uniform and immediate so that players, no matter how famous, know that they will immediately get a conduct penalty anytime they argue. Totally fine with that. Don't just enforce it arbitrarily and randomly.
Show me some.
NaomiKonjuhPotapova
G.O.A.T.
Did she or you just assume that she's act like "she’s the only mom, only sporting mom in the world and we should give her special treatment for that"
She’s a millionaire and surely has like paid off 10 nannies to watch and handle her child - You don't know that and nothing wrong to have nanny(es) if you can afford that.
That's too bad Kim did not making any commercial for it but so just because Kim did not Serena can't earn money for that?
a10best
Hall of Fame
I agree and said before that Serena doesn't need coaching (like the Warriors). She's figured it out so many times in the past 5 years. But she is older and Naomi is a far different server and baseliner than Kerber and Halep. She has not taken a set off Naomi in 2 meetings and is coached by Sascha.
This did give tennis more relevancy as controversial calls in sports is good for ratings.
Hopefully the AO will have them meet again.
abmk
Bionic Poster
I was appalled at how Serena stole the limelight (what little was left of it!) from Osaka. At what should have been the happiest moment, when they went back to their benches after the last point, Serena was standing there right next to Osaka screaming at the umpire, while Osaka was in tears.
Then in the awards ceremony, the USTA prez's comments were bad enough, and then Serena gave her little speech - "we'll get through this...." and then holding her 2nd-place silver plate over her head and parading in front of everybody with it. I wanted to say, "uh, Serena, that's the 2nd place trophy, not the 1st place." When they finally handed Osaka the main trophy, she looked like she didn't even want it. Poor girl. I hope she can pull out of this and go forward with a great career.
Rickenbacker4003
Hall of Fame
What do you mean cherry pick?! This is THE STATEMENT that anyone needs in this whole ordeal. It makes Serena’s tirade basically pointless. She said she didn’t cheat, her coach is part of her team and admitted giving signals. So unless she’s stupid or a bad liar she has no leg to stand on for that argument SHE STARTED.
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