Which is more "arm friendly" ProKennex Kinetic Pro 7G Racquets or Redondo ?????
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TW Staff
Administrator
The Prokennex 7g will be more arm friendly then the Heritage Type C Redondo. The kinetic technology is one of the best technologies when considering low shock and vibration.
Danny, TW
blackfrido
Hall of Fame
I suscribed to this opinion from my own experience.
After having TE I bought a PK 5G, what a difference with any other racquet I played back then. It really works when you're suffering of TE.
After having TE I bought a PK 5G, what a difference with any other racquet I played back then. It really works when you're suffering of TE.
shell
Professional
I own a Redondo MP and some 5Gs (but not 7Gs) and I think the 5Gs are probably a bit easier on the arm. But if you are comparing, remember that they are very different racquets. The Redondo is flexy and low powered, the 5G/7G will have a bit more power (the stiffness is in the mid 60s).
They both are considered arm friendly, so either should be fine based on your preference.
They both are considered arm friendly, so either should be fine based on your preference.
shell
Professional
They are both very stable, because they are both hefty racquets. You really need to demo them too, because they are really quite different. Having said that, you can't go wrong with either - unless you don't like the Redondo due to it's flexibility.
Captain Haddock
Rookie
The 7G is an extended frame, which is typically a concern for tennis elbow. I'd use the 5G, or the Redondo strung with a multifilament or a polyolefin string at a low tension.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
I've used the Redondo (used to have two of them) and I have a Ki5PSE. The Ki5 PSE is probably more stable than any other PK frame out there in stock form only because it weighs 12.9 ounces. It's arm-friendly in terms of shock and vibration but it wouldn't be if that amount of mass causes shoulder problems.
The non-Redondo frames tend to be bigger too which may help with shock and vibration with a bigger stringbed.
Stability (resistance to shock and vibration) can always be improved by adding lead tape to the racquet.
The non-Redondo frames tend to be bigger too which may help with shock and vibration with a bigger stringbed.
Stability (resistance to shock and vibration) can always be improved by adding lead tape to the racquet.
diredesire
Adjunct Moderator
No, it's more of a shh-shh sound, not really rattling. I don't hear it when I hit, but then again, I don't use my 7g as my main. Just a cool racquet to have around
In my experience, which, I must admit, is limited to one 5g racket I bought few weeks ago, the kinetic technology doesn't do anything to reduce the shock. I doubt the physics of it - what is the mass of that sand inside the frame?
Do you feel it when swinging your racket? Not a chance.
Now imagine or feel the kinetic energy that coming ball brings to your frame. Compare to the sand. Trust your senses.
Read carefully posts of people, raving about "arm friendliness" of 5g.
They go extra length to make it arm friendly, lowering tension to mid 40-ties, leading it up and stringing with VS natural gut and then attributing the success to kinetic technology!
In stock form, strung with poly at 60, 5g will wreck your arm dead. That's a fact. It's Pure Drive in disguise.
Just my experience - it takes some effort to make it playable.
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There are two things that make racket arm friendly - flex and mass.
String adds a lot too - type and tension.
Do you feel it when swinging your racket? Not a chance.
Now imagine or feel the kinetic energy that coming ball brings to your frame. Compare to the sand. Trust your senses.
Read carefully posts of people, raving about "arm friendliness" of 5g.
They go extra length to make it arm friendly, lowering tension to mid 40-ties, leading it up and stringing with VS natural gut and then attributing the success to kinetic technology!
In stock form, strung with poly at 60, 5g will wreck your arm dead. That's a fact. It's Pure Drive in disguise.
Just my experience - it takes some effort to make it playable.
-----------------------------------------------------------
There are two things that make racket arm friendly - flex and mass.
String adds a lot too - type and tension.
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movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
> what is the mass of that sand inside the frame?
Perhaps someone could cut one open and measure.
> They go extra length to make it arm friendly, lowering tension
> to mid 40-ties, leading it up and stringing with VS natural gut
> and then declare that kinetic technology works!
Most people going to PK are doing so because of arm problems so they're going to make it as arm-friendly as possible.
> In stock form, strung with poly at 60, 5g will wreck your arm
> dead. That's a fact. It's Pure Drive in disguise.
My Ki5 PSE is no pure drive. You have to work a lot hard to get power out of it. Certainly harder than using my stiff KPS88s to generate spin. That 12.9 ounce mass is also going to make it easier on your arm on groundstrokes.
Perhaps someone could cut one open and measure.
> They go extra length to make it arm friendly, lowering tension
> to mid 40-ties, leading it up and stringing with VS natural gut
> and then declare that kinetic technology works!
Most people going to PK are doing so because of arm problems so they're going to make it as arm-friendly as possible.
> In stock form, strung with poly at 60, 5g will wreck your arm
> dead. That's a fact. It's Pure Drive in disguise.
My Ki5 PSE is no pure drive. You have to work a lot hard to get power out of it. Certainly harder than using my stiff KPS88s to generate spin. That 12.9 ounce mass is also going to make it easier on your arm on groundstrokes.
thug the bunny
Professional
Don't know about the 5G, but I love my new Redondo C93. I don't have any arm problems, but it is the softest, most plush stick I have ever hit, so I imagine it must be very nice for the arm. I am using TF x1 BP 18g @ 54lbs. Plus it is very stable - it blocks back scorching first serves easily and with pace.
thug the bunny
Professional
Yes, you really need a long, well timed stroke to use the Redondo. Pushing, poking, and stabbing simply does not work with this stick. But if you are able to put a good swing on the ball, it rewards with exquisite feel and laser like accuracy. Plus, it makes the loudest "POP" sound I have ever heard - literally echoes across the courts - very cool.
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mikeler
Moderator
No, it's more of a shh-shh sound, not really rattling. I don't hear it when I hit, but then again, I don't use my 7g as my main. Just a cool racquet to have around
We both play with the PSTs. How would you compare the two?
diredesire
Adjunct Moderator
The feel is actually pretty similar, I'd say the 7G is a little more muted, but not in a bad way. Dampened might be a little more appropriate of a word. I felt the swingweight was more noticeable on the 7g (despite the specs). Serves were sharper with the PST. Spin control was better on the PST, but depth and directional control was better on the 7G. Anything else you're particularly interested in?
mikeler
Moderator
Nope, think you covered it. Been struggling with my shoulder serving with the PST the last few months. I used it for over a year with no problems though. Just wondering if the dampening of the PK 7G might be better. I know, extended rackets are worse for the shoulder but I'm short and that extra length really helps on my serve.
diredesire
Adjunct Moderator
I'm in the same boat, I'm not a tall dude. Just switching back (very recently) to extended length frames. haven't had a ton of time on the court, though. I also have shoulder problems, but I think the problem is more in my toss (ALL over the place). Keeping it in the court helps a lot. I personally think that shoulder problems are less the frame/string combo rather than technique, but there are always exceptions.
mikeler
Moderator
I'm in the same boat. My toss is all over the place. Last question, is the 7G much more comfortable? Thanks for all the info so far DD.
As a long time PK user, I must disagree with everything you said.
I string my 7G at 72 lbs with gut mains and 65 lbs poly crosses constant -pull.
At 65 RA, it is relatively stiff but definitely not a Pure Drive in disguise.
I have tried many racquets in search of arm comfort and PK7G is a real deal.
If you don't like it, that's fine. But i do not appreciate your "smarter-than-thou" attitude fully exhibited here.
diredesire
Adjunct Moderator
Honestly, I can't say for sure. I haven't logged enough hours on the 7g to say definitively (even for me). I have wrist and shoulder problems, and I've never experienced any discomfort the day after hitting with my 7G, but I've never switched to it as a full time frame, either.
I'll say (in line with scotus, above) that the 7g feels firm, but doesn't play or feel like other frames of the same RA. I find PD series (I might be switching to the PD+ soon, actually) to feel a little hollow, and a little buzzy. The 7G just feels very solid all around. If I could (have) found a pair at a nice price, I may have switched to the 7g full time (and gotten used to the sluggishness). [As an aside, I like to buy frames in pairs, and I almost always buy used]
R
rocky b
Guest
Sorry I disagree i suffered from TE along time and the 5g saved my arm. I use a poly with gut crosses and its a dream. I had the same set up in my Babolat and I was ready to cut my arm off due to the pain. PK is a great frame
galain
Hall of Fame
I am also going to respectfully disagree. I typically prefer much softer frames but the kinetics are fine sticks. I have also had ongoing issues with elbow pain and poly strings - even at 30lbs in an old soft Voelkl I was getting a sore elbow. I played a fortnight with a friends 7G string with SPPP at 63 and I never noticed a thing. I've even had a run with poly in my F200 - a softer 13oz frame you won't find - and it still brought pain. The PK is the only pain free experience I've had with poly strings.
That in itself is enough to convince me there is something to the kinetic technology.
mikeler
Moderator
I've got "a guy" who can get me a great deal on new ones. From all the comments above and yours, I think I'll buy one to try out. Worst case I should be able to sell it for what I buy it at.
I got my 5g a couple of months ago and was quite shocked how my experience with the frame was different from what I read.
It felt stiff and unstable, and it hurt my arm, first day I hit with it.
I cut the strings three times before I got something that I could hit the ball with and my wrist wouldn't hurt with first stroke.
I made it to work for me eventually, exactly the way others did - I have added 20g of lead at 2-10, lowered tension to 50/48 and using soft poly with syn cross instead of my favorite full poly.
With my former rackets - PS Zone 7.1, 200g, Head Classic MP - there were no such issues.
So I would go to Redondo or others with similar flex and mass for arm friendliness rather than to 5g.
7g appears to have a bit higher swingweight, so it's probably more stable and could be more comfortable, as well as PSE with more weight. But nothing works better than good old weight and flex.
I even thought maybe I've just been unlucky with the frame I got, I've heard they could be quite different. But, hey, if they could be different, you might be unlucky too.
Finally, before I forget about existence of this thread, one more thing about 5g. After all the changes, it plays quite well. It's got a bit more power than say PS 7.1 or 200g and still godd control. It loses a bit of comfort, but if you can manage that, it could be fine. It doesn't change my opinion about kinetic "technology" at all though. It was all about mass and softer stringbed.
Was it dumb enough this time?
It felt stiff and unstable, and it hurt my arm, first day I hit with it.
I cut the strings three times before I got something that I could hit the ball with and my wrist wouldn't hurt with first stroke.
I made it to work for me eventually, exactly the way others did - I have added 20g of lead at 2-10, lowered tension to 50/48 and using soft poly with syn cross instead of my favorite full poly.
With my former rackets - PS Zone 7.1, 200g, Head Classic MP - there were no such issues.
So I would go to Redondo or others with similar flex and mass for arm friendliness rather than to 5g.
7g appears to have a bit higher swingweight, so it's probably more stable and could be more comfortable, as well as PSE with more weight. But nothing works better than good old weight and flex.
I even thought maybe I've just been unlucky with the frame I got, I've heard they could be quite different. But, hey, if they could be different, you might be unlucky too.
Finally, before I forget about existence of this thread, one more thing about 5g. After all the changes, it plays quite well. It's got a bit more power than say PS 7.1 or 200g and still godd control. It loses a bit of comfort, but if you can manage that, it could be fine. It doesn't change my opinion about kinetic "technology" at all though. It was all about mass and softer stringbed.
Was it dumb enough this time?
basil J
Hall of Fame
I can't comment on the 7G but I was a longtime user of the Rendo Mp and a current user of the KI5. I had shoulder surgery in the spring of 08 and during my recovery I used the KI5 without issue. The redondo is extremely arm friendly as well, but for pretty lowpowered. The KI5 gives a little extra pop, but has a smaller sweet spot IMO than the Redondo. I use a 17G poly hybrid in both frames and neither bothered my arm. I think you should demo side by side, because they are completely different frames.
