ATP Rotterdam: Dominic Thiem vs Alexander Zverev (Zebra Brothers)

Who will win?

  • Thiem in 2

    Votes: 2 8.3%
  • Thiem in 3

    Votes: 5 20.8%
  • Zverev in 2

    Votes: 8 33.3%
  • Zverev in 3

    Votes: 9 37.5%

  • Total voters
    24

Meles

Bionic Poster
Thiem will not be denied.
laugh_above.gif
serving for match.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
I think this win is huge for Thiem. It says a lot about his game, the huge potential is there, however he has no back up plan and keeps tiring himself playing dem 250's and doubles.
At this stage Thiem badly needs matches after early exit last week. This win is a relief. Liking his chances for making Nishikori showdown in Rio a lot more atm.:p
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Your fence straddling will have you walking around bow legged for weeks now, first touting Zed as on his way to be betterer than fedr and now thiemerer is back. I think I'll put you back on "ignore" you're SoBad!:eek::rolleyes::eek::rolleyes:
Thiem fan always and he almost went down 5-0 in this match so my fears were justified. Zverev never quite found his top gear in this match. Zed still ahead of Fed.;) Looking forward to Thiemerer onwards. He's back on track. Sorry to dissappoint the Thiem trolls.:rolleyes:
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Thiem fan always and he almost went down 5-0 in this match so my fears were justified. Zverev never quite found his top gear in this match. Zed still ahead of Fed.;) Looking forward to Thiemerer onwards. He's back on track. Sorry to dissappoint the Thiem trolls.:rolleyes:
Any way the latest wind blows is your direction. Bandwagonerer Emeritus. SoSad.:rolleyes:
 

amorys90

Professional
Thiem fan always and he almost went down 5-0 in this match so my fears were justified. Zverev never quite found his top gear in this match. Zed still ahead of Fed.;) Looking forward to Thiemerer onwards. He's back on track. Sorry to dissappoint the Thiem trolls.:rolleyes:
Says the guy who picked Zed to win and claims he's better than Fed.
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
Thiem fan always and he almost went down 5-0 in this match so my fears were justified. Zverev never quite found his top gear in this match. Zed still ahead of Fed.;) Looking forward to Thiemerer onwards. He's back on track. Sorry to dissappoint the Thiem trolls.:rolleyes:
@Meles

I spent a week in the old pros section and come back here to see "Zed ahead of Fed"?

Did I just pop into an alternate reality?

What I see is a very good young guy who is unusual successful early on because his reasonably dangerous serve is mostly because of his height.

Don't get me wrong - the kid has lots of promise, if he stays healthy, but I'm exactly confident that we are looking at a 19 slam winner...
 
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TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Thiem fan always and he almost went down 5-0 in this match so my fears were justified. Zverev never quite found his top gear in this match. Zed still ahead of Fed.;) Looking forward to Thiemerer onwards. He's back on track. Sorry to dissappoint the Thiem trolls.:rolleyes:

Back on Thiem Track!!!!!!
Clay soon too!
He is finding his form back after injury and tweeking his game into place a bit. Maybe it is smart of him after all to play a lot of tournaments to get his game settled.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Back on Thiem Track!!!!!!
Clay soon too!
He is finding his form back after injury and tweeking his game into place a bit. Maybe it is smart of him after all to play a lot of tournaments to get his game settled.
I agree. He may eventually tire like last year in Rio. He played himself into good form today after an awful start. When he wins Rotterdam, Rio, and Acapulco back to back we can talk about overplaying.:D
 

TheMusicLover

G.O.A.T.
Great victory for Thiem in a very close match, my congrats to him, and no disgrace to Zverev...

Pretty bad that these two young guns had to play each other so soon in an ATP 500-tournament.

The possibility of a Berdych - Goffin final is still on, though! :D
 

Kalin

Legend
Tough one for Zverev, narrowly misses a seeding and ends up playing the 2nd seed in the first round. And RBA pulls out after the draw was made to pour salt on the wound...

That royally sucked indeed. Didn't know about RBA but was surprised Z. didn't make it to a seed.

The ATP should urgently implement two new rules:

1. No first round Zebra bs Zebra matches allowed

2. Simon should be asked to withdraw every time he's scheduled to play a Zebra, for the beauty of the game!
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
@Meles

You're a quisling, that's what you are! (For those of you who have forgotten the wonderful comments of Levi.) :D
I hope your claim of being a quisling is not aimed my way. I liked Thiem a lot before he started camping out 20 feet behind the baseline on HCs and then went berserk gonzo, gotta play every week and practice 12 hours a day. It sucked that the height of his folly coincided with the only player I pledge total allegiance to going on the shelf for six months. My blues were softened by a slaminal and a babyGOAT Renaissance. But, when they line up against each other, I'm all in for the old guy with the elegant strokes.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
@Meles

I spent a week in the old pros section and come back here to see "Zed ahead of Fed"?

Did I just pop into an alternate reality?

What I see is a very good young guy who is unusual successful early on because his reasonably dangerous serve is mostly because of his height.

Don't get me wrong - the kid has lots of promise, if he stays healthy, but I'm exactly confident that we are looking at a 19 slam winner...
Just the facts in that thread and Zed is ahead of Fed in his progress with his 2nd tournament win at age 19.

Zed was dead tired today (well maybe not that much), but the stats engine is looking strong. I don't think he's been really playing all that well in most of his matches and had a lot of three setters last week (everything but the final.) Here is the stats engine:
1. Zverev won 39.6% of his return points on hard courts starting with US Open in 2016 with notably strong first return numbers
2. Now in 2017 he's jumped from 63.9% on serve points to 65.3%.
3. Games won percent on serve is even more impressive surging from 81% in 2016 to 86% in 2017
4. Zverev is up 2.0% on points won for the early part of 2017 versus the same period in 2016. 49.7% up to 51.7% now.

Zverev was around over 53% points won last Fall until he slumped a bit; he could easily get back to that kind of performance. I expect that clay and grass will be Zverev's best surfaces, so all told he's on ATG track.

I'm not saying Zverev will end up his career with more slams then Fed, but I expect him to pull ahead of Federer's progress for a 3 year window.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
@Meles

You're a quisling, that's what you are! (For those of you who have forgotten the wonderful comments of Levi.) :D
Sorry I just like what I'm seeing in the game right now. Zverev and Dimitrov on the rise undoubtably. Thiem showing signs of life. Fedal back and ready to contend. Its an amazing to group of players at the top of the tour with no Berdy or Ferrer to make the latter stages boring.:D
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
I hope your claim of being a quisling is not aimed my way. I liked Thiem a lot before he started camping out 20 feet behind the baseline on HCs and then went berserk gonzo, gotta play every week and practice 12 hours a day. It sucked that the height of his folly coincided with the only player I pledge total allegiance to going on the shelf for six months. My blues were softened by a slaminal and a babyGOAT Renaissance. But, when they line up against each other, I'm all in for the old guy with the elegant strokes.
Thiemerer forgives you.:D
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
I hope your claim of being a quisling is not aimed my way. I liked Thiem a lot before he started camping out 20 feet behind the baseline on HCs and then went berserk gonzo, gotta play every week and practice 12 hours a day. It sucked that the height of his folly coincided with the only player I pledge total allegiance to going on the shelf for six months. My blues were softened by a slaminal and a babyGOAT Renaissance. But, when they line up against each other, I'm all in for the old guy with the elegant strokes.
You missed my joke. Levi once said that to me.

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/federer-on-rafael-nadal.547109/#post-9751973

It was the most bizarre thing anyone has ever said to me in a forum!

As for Thiem, I'd argue that his far back stance is Nadal-like and may pay big dividends on clay. But I don't like the tactic on fast courts and wonder who encouraged that...
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
Just the facts in that thread and Zed is ahead of Fed in his progress with his 2nd tournament win at age 19.

Zed was dead tired today (well maybe not that much), but the stats engine is looking strong. I don't think he's been really playing all that well in most of his matches and had a lot of three setters last week (everything but the final.) Here is the stats engine:
1. Zverev won 39.6% of his return points on hard courts starting with US Open in 2016 with notably strong first return numbers
2. Now in 2017 he's jumped from 63.9% on serve points to 65.3%.
3. Games won percent on serve is even more impressive surging from 81% in 2016 to 86% in 2017
4. Zverev is up 2.0% on points won for the early part of 2017 versus the same period in 2016. 49.7% up to 51.7% now.

Zverev was around over 53% points won last Fall until he slumped a bit; he could easily get back to that kind of performance. I expect that clay and grass will be Zverev's best surfaces, so all told he's on ATG track.

I'm not saying Zverev will end up his career with more slams then Fed, but I expect him to pull ahead of Federer's progress for a 3 year window.
It's great seeing someone so young doing so well, but so far to me he mostly looks like a very dangerous, tall baseliner. If he doesn't learn some important net skills from his big brother, I don't trust him to get much better, especially if the recent trend of using faster balls continues.

That was the one thing that impressed me about Raonic around the beginning of 2016. He looked like he was getting super aggressive behind the big serve. Unfortunately that someone seems to have plateaued and then dropped. I don't trust him to get any better. I think he's peaked, probably surpassed what most people expected of him.

I don't trust Zverev not to start having injury problems. I don't trust his game as it is. So far too defensive, in spite of a lot of power.

I want to see those stats stabilize over several months. When he has to work so hard to win small tournaments, that's not a good sign for winning the big ones.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
It's great seeing someone so young doing so well, but so far to me he mostly looks like a very dangerous, tall baseliner. If he doesn't learn some important net skills from his big brother, I don't trust him to get much better, especially if the recent trend of using faster balls continues.

That was the one thing that impressed me about Raonic around the beginning of 2016. He looked like he was getting super aggressive behind the big serve. Unfortunately that someone seems to have plateaued and then dropped. I don't trust him to get any better. I think he's peaked, probably surpassed what most people expected of him.

I don't trust Zverev not to start having injury problems. I don't trust his game as it is. So far too defensive, in spite of a lot of power.

I want to see those stats stabilize over several months. When he has to work so hard to win small tournaments, that's not a good sign for winning the big ones.
Luckily for Thiem Sascha's net game was pretty poor today, but that also had a lot to do with Thiem who is no picnic for netrushers with his heavy topspin from both sides. I do think he's bound to improved with his brother in the camp. Part of his better serve games stats is that he is attacking more at the net and has times where he times the forehand quite well. Thiem served a bit harder then Zverev. With Jez Green training Zverev I think he's going to stay relatively healthy, get even more serve velocity, etc., etc.. He's going to be a beast. For me the critical element is his return game. If he can win over 39.0% of his return points that puts him a notch above Sampras and I like that his first return is relatively strong which gives him the ability to break even when an opponent is serving well. Z just needs to get hot and breaks happen. He broke Tsonga a lot at the end of their match which was very, very impressive.

I think faster conditions are not good for Raonic. Raonic was generally out of sorts at Wimbledon and was very lucky to get past Goffin and then of course with Fed he snatched victory from the jaws of defeat. He did not prosper down under with these conditions either. His serve is good enough on the slowest surfaces, but the rest of his game is under pressure when things are faster. As long as the servebots are generally kept at bay I am fine with these conditions.

No way is Zverev winning a masters 1000 this year with Fedal back on the prowl. That's just too many good players in the way. I'm just hoping for some deep runs where he gets more nice scalps.:p
 
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