2019 Madrid ATP SF: RAFA [2] vs Tsitsipas [8]

Mainad · May 11, 2019

="WhiskeyEE, post: 13334669, member: 29296"]I watched sets 2 and 3 and when Nadal pressed and made his shots, Tsitsipas was completely helpless. Nadal just played bad today. It isn't really a good win. Just good to get the monkey off his back and not "lose to Nadal 10 times in a row," which he was apparently worried about

Well, tonight he managed not to lose to him 4 times in a row so he needn't worry about that any longer.

="WhiskeyEE, post: 13334669, member: 29296"]
Let's see Tsitsipas beat a Big 3 player (old and over the hill nonetheless) when they aren't playing like absolute crap before we hype him.

Did you really think Nadal was playing like crap tonight or was the unrelenting pressure he was put under by Tsitsipas (except in the 2nd set) force him off his game? He was put under such pressure by the Greek's sheer speed around the court and his phenomenal ball-striking that it was small wonder he finally cracked. Age difference might also have played a part with 20 year old Tsitsipas adopting the role that, once upon a time, 20 year old Nadal would have played. We may simply be witnessing finally the passing of the torch but, of course, we have to wait and see if his consistency can match anything like that of the older greats.

George Turner · May 11, 2019

EllieK said:
They dont like a brash attitude in a youngster but they forget that that is what it takes to win. Too much deference to the opponent will never get you over the finish line.

A player like Nishikori is very humble and accepts his place in the pecking order. What has he won?

Every champion whose ever gotten to the very top has that brash arrogance. Tsitsipas is producing a few results to back his own up, which is great to see.

WhiskeyEE · May 11, 2019

Mainad said:
Well, tonight he managed not to lose to him 4 times in a row so he needn't worry about that any longer.

Did you really think Nadal was playing like crap tonight or was the unrelenting pressure he was put under by Tsitsipas (except in the 2nd set) force him off his game? He was put under such pressure by the Greek's sheer speed around the court and his phenomenal ball-striking that it was small wonder he finally cracked. Age difference might also have played a part with 20 year old Tsitsipas adopting the role that, once upon a time, 20 year old Nadal would have played. We may simply be witnessing finally the passing of the torch but, of course, we have to wait and see if his consistency can match anything like that of the older greats.

Nadal hasn't won a single title this year. He played the worst clay court match I've ever seen from him against Fognini and recently destroyed Tsitsipas in Australia immediately before his recent drop in form. So, yeah, my sense of reasoning tells me that it's most likely that he just played bad. And so do my eyes.

Mainad · May 11, 2019

I Am Finnish said:
Ypu mean Djokovic has crushed his soul?

Djokovic has been doing that for the past 8 years but Nadal has always bounced back especially at his favourite tournaments. But does he only have Djokovic to worry about anymore?

joekapa · May 11, 2019

NuBas said:
Uhh Zverev has been that way for a long time already and not borderline cheater like Stefanos.

Why people dislike Zverev no idea but quite similar to how people hate on Bouchard.

Don't dislike Zverev. But how was he at 20 ? Think he will win his fair share in due time.

natalia · May 11, 2019

Stefanos, my HERO!!!!!!

Im(moral) Winner · May 11, 2019

If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

vive le beau jeu ! · May 11, 2019

veroniquem said:
He’s gonna have plenty of time to like himself in the shower tomorrow after Nadal is done with him

oh yeah... i'm sure he will !!!

Im(moral) Winner said:
If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

ultimate humbalitoness

Mainad · May 11, 2019

WhiskeyEE said:
Nadal hasn't won a single title this year. He played the worst clay court match I've ever seen from him against Fognini and recently destroyed Tsitsipas in Australia immediately before his recent drop in form. So, yeah, my sense of reasoning tells me that it's most likely that he just played bad. And so do my eyes.

And you really don't think Tsitsipas stepped it up another level since their meeting in Australia?

WhiskeyEE · May 11, 2019

Mainad said:
And you really don't think Tsitsipas stepped it up another level since their meeting in Australia?

No. I don't. It looked identical to Australia when Nadal was making his shots in the 2nd set. Nadal started missing a lot and that's what let Tsitsipas back into the match.

His level in this match was significantly worse than when Almagro and Ferrer beat him back in 2014.

Boom-Boom · May 11, 2019

Im(moral) Winner said:
If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

EllieK · May 11, 2019

George Turner said:
A player like Nishikori is very humble and accepts his place in the pecking order. What has he won?

Every champion whose ever gotten to the very top has that brash arrogance. Tsitsipas is producing a few results to back his own up, which is great to see.

Totally agree. I'm tired Of people calling A champions in it To win it arrogance. No player has ever gotten to the top without at least a little.

EllieK · May 11, 2019

Im(moral) Winner said:
If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

But Tsitsipas is the arrogant one?

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Nadal is almost 33 years old. It stands to reason that some of these younger guys are now able to beat him. A 20 year old vs. 33 year old - yet, Nadal is still better than about 85-90% of players.......

George Turner · May 11, 2019

Im(moral) Winner said:
If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

Nadal here is simply showing his champions arrogance (that for some reason people don't think he has.) quite a normal thing to do.

And he is correct, he did not play like he did in Barcelona last year.

Mainad · May 11, 2019

veroniquem said:
He’s gonna have plenty of time to like himself in the shower tomorrow after Nadal is done with him

No love for Stefanos then? Thought you were in to Greek gods?

Deleted member 77403 · May 11, 2019

natalia · May 11, 2019

EllieK · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
Nadal is almost 33 years old. It stands to reason that some of these younger guys are now able to beat him. A 20 year old vs. 33 year old - yet, Nadal is still better than about 85-90% of players.......

You do realize that Stefanos played a 3 set quarter final singles and a match tiebreaker doubles semi yesterday and came back today and won. I dont care if he is only 20, that's some tough stuff

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

I think Thiem and Tsistpas are the best young players...and they can both beat top players like Nadal, Djokovic and Federer.....which none of the young players were ever able to do before.

moonballs · May 11, 2019

mike danny said:
Is it just me or Rafa has 0 top 10 wins this year?

Sometimes you don’t need to beat top 10 to win titles if you have cakewalk draws. Only WTF eliminates cakewalk draws.

Deleted member 77403 · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

The fact is Tsipias is 20 years old and Nadal is 33 years old...huge difference. For quite some time, none of these younger guys ever challenged Nadal...now the tide changed and we finally have some younger guys that can beat guys like Nadal, Djokovic and Fed...it's the first time it happened.....and it's like when Nadal and Fed were young and 20-25 and beat all the old guys...now it's happening to them.

EllieK · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
I think Thiem and Tsistpas are the best young players...and they can both beat top players like Nadal, Djokovic and Federer.....which none of the young players were ever able to do before.

Shapo beat Nadal.

Pmasterfunk · May 11, 2019

maratha_warrior said:
Rafa's volleys today were as good as Djokovic's Overheads .

Ironically i actually saw Djokovic hit a great smash today.

I've said it before: 2019 keeps on giving.

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Tsitsipas is a very good player....but he's scares me. I can have nightmares looking at that guy

joekapa · May 11, 2019

Tennis is a lonely sport. Those at the top know this. Those who are not at the top, can still travel the world and live a great life. But they won't make an impact that way.

Stefanos knows this. I'm sure of it. It's not arrogance per se. It's necessity.

acintya · May 11, 2019

WhiskeyEE said:
Nadal hasn't won a single title this year. He played the worst clay court match I've ever seen from him against Fognini and recently destroyed Tsitsipas in Australia immediately before his recent drop in form. So, yeah, my sense of reasoning tells me that it's most likely that he just played bad. And so do my eyes.

something like that

Mainad · May 11, 2019

WhiskeyEE said:
No. I don't. It looked identical to Australia when Nadal was making his shots in the 2nd set. Nadal started missing a lot and that's what let Tsitsipas back into the match.

His level in this match was significantly worse than when Almagro and Ferrer beat him back in 2014.

You're a hard guy to please. If Tsitsipas had played exactly the way he did in Australia I doubt he would have beaten Nadal tonight anymore than he did then.

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Yes - Dennis Schapovalov beat Nadal...but Shapovalov is in a 2nd tier of young players...he's nowhere near a Tsitipas or Thiem....who are top tier.....Schapolalov might get there with time...and was lucky to beat Nadal on an "off day"....

joekapa · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
The fact is Tsipias is 20 years old and Nadal is 33 years old...huge difference. For quite some time, none of these younger guys ever challenged Nadal...now the tide changed and we finally have some younger guys that can beat guys like Nadal, Djokovic and Fed...it's the first time it happened.....and it's like when Nadal and Fed were young and 20-25 and beat all the old guys...now it's happening to them.

He is 20 y.o, who hasn't fully developed, in terms of muscle mass, and brain. They are both growing. What he did today was massive in my books.

Pmasterfunk · May 11, 2019

Im(moral) Winner said:
If I was at my peak

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1127339155392999425

LTG levels of saltiness

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Yes - it was a massive win...but he's 13 years younger than an aging Nadal at 33 years old. It used to be that guys would retire when they turned 30....but we have had quite a few guys who still play, and win, in their 30's....namely Djokovic, Fed and Nadal.....they all were supreme players - but it can't last forever. The aging process takes over and before you know, qualifiers will begin to beat them. Fed and Nadal were winning titles against "older guys" when they were in their teens. They were special players and Tsitpas shows the same qualities.

stringertom · May 11, 2019

WhiskeyEE said:
I watched sets 2 and 3 and when Nadal pressed and made his shots, Tsitsipas was completely helpless. Nadal just played bad today. It isn't really a good win. Just good to get the monkey off his back and not "lose to Nadal 10 times in a row," which he was apparently worried about.

Let's see Tsitsipas beat a Big 3 player (old and over the hill nonetheless) when they aren't playing like absolute crap before we hype him.

fedr wasn’t his best at AO but Tsits played big points betterer. At Toronto’18, Tsits won vs Joe Kovic with incredibly high quality shotmaking:

WhiskeyEE · May 11, 2019

Mainad said:
You're a hard guy to please. If Tsitsipas had played exactly the way he did in Australia I doubt he would have beaten Nadal tonight anymore than he did then.

Not really. I applauded Thiem today despite his loss.

NuBas · May 11, 2019

joekapa said:
Don't dislike Zverev. But how was he at 20 ? Think he will win his fair share in due time.

I think he had already won Rome and Canada M1000 when he was 20, he is actually on a faster trajectory than all other players.

Tsitsipas isn't the first one to adopt this attitude, I personally believe it was Zverev who I noticed as one of the first NextGens who really had strong self belief.

WhiskeyEE · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
Yes - Dennis Schapovalov beat Nadal...but Shapovalov is in a 2nd tier of young players...he's nowhere near a Tsitipas or Thiem....who are top tier.....Schapolalov might get there with time...and was lucky to beat Nadal on an "off day"....

Shapo beat Nadal right before he won the US Open. Not during one of the worst slumps of Nadal's career.

Ray Mercer · May 11, 2019

Nadal’s always been a poor sport. He doesn’t take losses well and I hate the way he always says that his opponents shots are out on clay. The fact is he’s got his ass whipped 3 times already on clay. These young guys have better legs than him now. Nadal was always dependent on his legs and the luck that he’s a lefty.

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Shapo isn't consistent....he doesn't seem to be a guy that is a top tier player at the moment...maybe in the future...I truthfully don't think they'll ever be any players like Fed/Nadal who dominated the sport for so many years. Those 2 guys won most of the slams for over a decade......

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Never thought of Nadal as a poor sport...or Fed...but both are "unhappy" when they lose and look like sour pusses. I haven't seem many "happy losers".....

Ray Mercer · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
Never thought of Nadal as a poor sport...or Fed...but both are "unhappy" when they lose and look like sour pusses. I haven't seem many "happy losers".....

Compare Federer’s handshake at the net in the loss to Thiem at Indian Wells vs Nadals today and vs Kyrgios. It’s a night and day difference. Nadal has always been a scumbag in losses .

EllieK · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
Tsitsipas is a very good player....but he's scares me. I can have nightmares looking at that guy

I can have dreams but they ain't nightmares.

Latetothegame · May 11, 2019

I Am Finnish said:
Murygoat

Will always be a stain on his resume

helterskelter · May 11, 2019

I think there will be in the future, but probably not in the next generation. It could well be that there are five or so years of relative parity after the top three retire or stop winning. Perhaps much more than five years. But at some point in the future, there are likely to be dominant players again.

Atherton2003 said:
Shapo isn't consistent....he doesn't seem to be a guy that is a top tier player at the moment...maybe in the future...I truthfully don't think they'll ever be any players like Fed/Nadal who dominated the sport for so many years. Those 2 guys won most of the slams for over a decade......

MichaelNadal · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
Nadal is almost 33 years old. It stands to reason that some of these younger guys are now able to beat him. A 20 year old vs. 33 year old - yet, Nadal is still better than about 85-90% of players.......

This

mike danny · May 11, 2019

Atherton2003 said:
The fact is Tsipias is 20 years old and Nadal is 33 years old...huge difference. For quite some time, none of these younger guys ever challenged Nadal...now the tide changed and we finally have some younger guys that can beat guys like Nadal, Djokovic and Fed...it's the first time it happened.....and it's like when Nadal and Fed were young and 20-25 and beat all the old guys...now it's happening to them.

Fed has been dealing with young players since 2005.

It's Djokodal who have lacked them.

Towser83 · May 11, 2019

What the actual hell???

Atherton2003 · May 11, 2019

Nadal is a great sportsman......as is Fed.....the best players EVER in tennis....and I for one, am grateful to be able to watch them both in my lifetime.....

Latetothegame · May 11, 2019

NuBas said:
Uhh Zverev has been that way for a long time already and not borderline cheater like Stefanos.

Why people dislike Zverev no idea but quite similar to how people hate on Bouchard.

Don't be so tribal, lots of people don't like Tsitipas either for many perceived reasons
Zverev need these other young players snapping at his heals, it will make him a better player, you come across as you have no faith in him

mightyjeditribble · May 11, 2019

oldmanfan said:
Here's a nutty possibility. Tsits is ALREADY the winningest match player of 2019 atm, but he also COULD leave Madrid as the winningest titlist (3) too!

He is now #4 in the race. Should be win Madrid, he'd be #2, 200 points behind Djokovic. :O

(Sent from my mobile phone.)

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